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Old 09-18-2009, 04:01 PM
Cukeman Cukeman is a male United States Cukeman is offline
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monster musings

Was the MC backstory the first appearance of monsters?

What happened to the monsters at the end of The Minish Cap?

Why were there active monsters on the Great Sea in WW when
the monsters in Hyrule-Under-The-Sea were frozen?
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Old 09-18-2009, 04:10 PM
Beemnorv Beemnorv is a male Canada Beemnorv is offline
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Re: monster musings

1. Maybe. That would explain why people weren't very prepared and needed the Picori to help them. Also, perhaps the backstory for TMC showed a time where monsters were natural creatures in Hyrule.

2. I think that they were teleported someplace else. It doesn't seem right for things to just vanish as a solution to the problem.

3. I really don't know. Maybe the under-the-sea monsters were just ancient ones and the above-sea ones were newly recruited/created or something.
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Old 09-18-2009, 04:15 PM
Cukeman Cukeman is a male United States Cukeman is offline
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Re: monster musings

3. Ganon said that the seal on the frozen monsters limited his magic. It doesn't seem right that
he can call new monsters forth, yet not awaken the frozen ones... but there may be another explanation
such as that only the monsters attacking the castle were frozen
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Old 09-18-2009, 04:19 PM
Triforce of the Gods Triforce of the Gods is a male United States Triforce of the Gods is offline
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Re: monster musings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cukeman View Post
3. Ganon said that the seal on the frozen monsters limited his magic. It doesn't seem right that
he can call new monsters forth, yet not awaken the frozen ones... but there may be another explanation
such as that only the monsters attacking the castle were frozen
That was actually a mistranslation:

1st line: Original Japanese
2nd line: Literal Re-Translated Japanese
3rd line: NoA Translation

Quote:
その剣は、魔を撃退する退魔の剣 であると同時に、 我が魔族を封じていた、いまいましい封印 そのものなのだよ!
That sword is the Anti-Demon Sword that repels demons. However, it is also the annoying seal that was sealing my Mazoku.
Foolish child. While that sword is indeed the blade of evil's bane, at the same time, it has long played another role... You see, it is also a sort of key... a most wretched little key that has kept the seal on me and my magic intact!
Quote:
Note:

Ganondorf refers to the monsters as his mazoku. This literally means "Demon Tribe" or "Demon Race". The mazoku would be those he commands as the maou (Demon King).

----------------jacensolo06
So I don't see why he can't create new ones.
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Old 09-18-2009, 04:27 PM
Cukeman Cukeman is a male United States Cukeman is offline
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Re: monster musings

In that case, the seal only applies to the Demon Tribe who attacked the castle, right?
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Old 09-18-2009, 04:27 PM
Beemnorv Beemnorv is a male Canada Beemnorv is offline
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Re: monster musings

Also, some of the monsters could very well be natural on the Great Sea. Kargaroks seem to be natural.
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Old 09-18-2009, 05:51 PM
Cukeman Cukeman is a male United States Cukeman is offline
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Re: monster musings

but it was the live vs frozen moblins that threw me
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Old 09-18-2009, 06:34 PM
TheGhostOfMandrag TheGhostOfMandrag is a male United States TheGhostOfMandrag is offline
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Re: monster musings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cukeman View Post
What happened to the monsters at the end of The Minish Cap?
Nothing, I'd wager. Vaati let them out of the sword's seal and then was, himself, sealed by said sword (alone if the intro cutscene to Four Swords directly follows). Since the monsters were independent of him, I don't think anything would to them.
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Old 09-18-2009, 07:13 PM
Beemnorv Beemnorv is a male Canada Beemnorv is offline
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Re: monster musings

^ At the end of MC, Zelda wishes Hyrule back to normal and all the monsters vanish in poofs of smoke.
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Old 09-18-2009, 11:19 PM
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Re: monster musings

The enemies frozen underwater were monster who existed at the time of the seal. The ones we have in the surface are new ones created after the seal. That's my guess anyways.
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Old 09-19-2009, 01:24 AM
TheGhostOfMandrag TheGhostOfMandrag is a male United States TheGhostOfMandrag is offline
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Re: monster musings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemnorv View Post
^ At the end of MC, Zelda wishes Hyrule back to normal and all the monsters vanish in poofs of smoke.
Guess I forgot. Been a while since I played it.
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Old 09-19-2009, 01:26 PM
bitterlime Germany bitterlime is offline
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Re: monster musings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cukeman View Post
Was the MC backstory the first appearance of monsters?
We don't know...

Quote:
What happened to the monsters at the end of The Minish Cap?
They poof...most probable only those who came from the chest dissapeared though.
Quote:
Why were there active monsters on the Great Sea in WW when
the monsters in Hyrule-Under-The-Sea were frozen?
The seal is local
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Old 09-19-2009, 01:35 PM
Beemnorv Beemnorv is a male Canada Beemnorv is offline
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Re: monster musings

The seal was on Ganondorf's "mazoku", which means that if the seal is intact, he cannot create new monsters. Notice how more monsters start appearing after you pull out the Master Sword, like the Chuchus on Outset Island. That doesn't explain how he created Jalhalla and Molgera though (unless he made them before the seal was cast). Some of the above-sea monsters seem to be natural though like Kargaroks and Peahats.
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Last Edited by Beemnorv; 09-19-2009 at 01:35 PM. Reason: Reply With Quote
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Old 09-19-2009, 01:36 PM
Cukeman Cukeman is a male United States Cukeman is offline
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Re: monster musings

how do we know that there are "natural" monsters?
there doesn't seem to be any in Hyrule before Vaati opens
the chest
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Old 09-19-2009, 01:41 PM
bitterlime Germany bitterlime is offline
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Re: monster musings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cukeman View Post
how do we know that there are "natural" monsters?
there doesn't seem to be any in Hyrule before Vaati opens
the chest
I'm 100% certain that there was at least a deku scrub on the way to the castle.
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Old 09-19-2009, 01:45 PM
Beemnorv Beemnorv is a male Canada Beemnorv is offline
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Re: monster musings

You can't explore Hyrule before Vaati opens the chest. Kargaroks are natural because a Rito tells you that his girlfriend likes golden feathers (which you get mostly from Kargaroks), suggesting that they've been around for quite a while.

Peahats are natural because they only attack you to protect their nest (in OoT) and they disappear when Ganondorf takes over Hyrule. If they were monsters, there would be more of them once Ganondorf took over. The same goes for Stalchildren.

If everything you could kill were a monster, the only animals in Hyrule would be cuccos, pigs, horses, cows, and bugs.
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Last Edited by Beemnorv; 09-19-2009 at 01:46 PM. Reason: Reply With Quote
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:05 PM
Cukeman Cukeman is a male United States Cukeman is offline
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Re: monster musings

I don't think Deku Scrubs are monsters. They don't spit seeds on purpose, they
are trying to talk to you, and they hide when you draw near.

Mad Scrubs are a different matter. They are violent and invade Kokiri Forest
when Ganon comes to power.

I think the Deku Scrubs in FSA just choose to ally themselves to Ganon, like
Ingo did in OoT.

Kargaroks and Seahats could be monsters. Moblins are, so the active Moblins in
the Forsaken Fortress show that there are live monsters while some remain frozen.

Peahats aren't natural they are the ghost of a flower.

Stalchildren seem to be possessed bones. Some sort of a curse or evil spirit
bringing them to life. Monsters begin as monsters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemnorv View Post
If everything you could kill were a monster, the only animals in Hyrule would be cuccos, pigs, horses, cows, and bugs.
Which I believe to be the case. Aside from monsters there are animals and
spirit beings (stalfos/children, peahats, bubbles)
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:43 PM
Beemnorv Beemnorv is a male Canada Beemnorv is offline
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Re: monster musings

Jeez, Hylians don't have a lot of food. Pretty much just chicken, pork, beef, and grass.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:50 PM
bitterlime Germany bitterlime is offline
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Re: monster musings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemnorv View Post
Jeez, Hylians don't have a lot of food. Pretty much just chicken, pork, beef, and grass.
Apples? They are pretty common in Hyrule. They even sell them on the market in TP...despite there not being a single apple tree to be discovered.
Pumpkins
Fish
I think in general we can assume that Hyrule has animals like we do, despite the fact that we don't see them on a regular basis.
Very few Zelda games have cats. TP had many. And OoS had 1 cat. I think it's save to assume that there were cat's in the other games too, despite being apparently absent.

At cukeman:
Mad scrubs and Deku scrubs are the same thing basicly...you can't call one a monster and call the other one a species. Deku scrubs can clearly be benevolent and malicious, just like any other species.
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Last Edited by bitterlime; 09-19-2009 at 02:54 PM. Reason: Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)   [ ]
Old 09-19-2009, 03:21 PM
Cukeman Cukeman is a male United States Cukeman is offline
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Re: monster musings

it's just that 'mad scrub' implies that the red scrubs are never anything but violent
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