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Old 12-14-2008, 08:45 PM
Skylark Skylark is a male United States Skylark is offline
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Analysis of the Trident of Power

A Full Analysis of the Trident of Power
By Skylark


A mysterious trident, unofficially dubbed "The Trident of Power" amongst Zelda fans has been Ganon's staple weapon in all of the 2D games. While not using it in LoZ, official artwork and LoZ BS, a remake of LoZ both show him wielding this weapon. Since then, the trident has appeared in Alltp, the Oracles, and FSA, where it became story relevant.



FOUR SWORD ADVENTURES


Since NoA failed on this subject, we will look at the japanese translations relevent to the trident in FSA.
Quote:
The man who took the Tridnet, the evil "ja-ki" of the demon resurrected from anceint times
Now this leaves us with the question of what is a "ja-ki." Jumbie, a well known translator for the Zelda community believe it meant "tool or device" essentially being the ancient demon's weapon. However, Prime Blue, another translator insisted it meant "vessel." This is supported by other quotes in FSA relating to the trident.

Quote:
We...grant you...power to
...ruin...the world. The
power of...darkness.

Evil...spirit of
magic trident.

You are...the...
King of Darkness.
Quote:
Evil spirit... Spirit of magic?
Trident? This indentation is
in the shape of a weapon.
If the trident is a vessel for a spirit. It would mean that Ganondorf was the man who took up the spirit housed in the trident, allowing him to become the King of Darkness.

The Oracles Linked Ending

During the Resurrection attempt of OoX, Twinrova states they will summon Ganon's spirit into "the vessel." This was originally thought to be Zelda, as she was the sacrifice. However, when Twinrova sacrifices herself, she vanishes. This leads to the idea that the sacrifice was just used to recreate Ganon's body. If that is the case, what is the "vessel?"
This quote from the Japanese helps show that the vessel and the sacrifice are two different things.
Quote:
The resurrection of Daimaou Ganon is but a matter of time.
The return of the Evil King Ganon approaches.

「聖なるイケニエ」ゼルダを よりしろに ガノンのタマシイを よびよせれば かんせいじゃ! われらが じきじきに じごくへ おくってくれるわ!
When we sacrifice Zelda, the “Holy Sacrifice”, and summon Ganon’s spirit into the yorishiro, it will be complete! We will personally send you to hell!
Our sacrifice of Zelda is all that remains! When we call Ganon's spirit into the vessel, it will be done! You can't stop us! Prepare to meet your doom!
A yorishiro is a inanimate object that is used to hold a spirit. It literally means "approach substitute." Given the information from FSA, we can accurately conclude that the yorishiro is the trident.

Therefore, after Link defeats Ganon in OoX his spirit lived on in the trident, as it resided there instead of in the body. Ganon rested until the trident was claimed by a new Gerudo (conviently named Ganondorf) in FSA. In which he took the same form as his predecessor and seemed to become him all together.

In Alltp, Ganon carelessly throws the trident away midfight. I believe this is because inhabiting a new body renders the trident useless, as it is no longer the vessel.

Therefore, the Ganon in OoX being revived is the same ganon/dorf from OoT/TWW(and possibly LoZ.) He then takes over another body in FSA, effectively completely the resurrection that was attempted before. This allows for the same Ganon/dorf to be the villan throughout the series.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Notes and history of this article:
-I originally thought of the trident being a vessel for Ganon's soul back in a LoZ placement debate with Ollathir when I was still new to the forums. Erimgard helped me in obtained Prime Blue's translations to support it. However, I still needed the moment in which his soul was connected to it.

-A few weeks later I was able to luckily able find the Japanese roms of the oracles. I sent copies to Erimgard and a few translators, however I never got a reply. Months later Lex made a thread with the translations of the resurrection scene, giving me the moment of the soul being bound to the trident I needed to finish the theory. This is also when the idea became widespread about the forums.

- This also I think gets rid of the idea of the FSA Ganondorf being a reincarnation of the previous one, as his soul is in the trident. The only exception is if you believe that Ganondorf and Ganon have different souls.

-I originally planned on making this article much sooner, right after the OoX translations came. However I was being bombarded with school work (I lie, I was playing video games.)

-Now, you might ask. "Why is Sky trying to tell us of all his awesome exploits in the making of this article?" The answer is that the awards are coming up soon, and I want you to be reminded of them
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Hmm, The official timeline reminds me alot of my original theory. The Rejected Hero of Time.

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Old 12-14-2008, 08:57 PM
theunabletable theunabletable is a male United States theunabletable is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Pretty good article. We already know all of this. But it will be nice to be able to view a full analysis at any time we need to.
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Old 12-14-2008, 09:00 PM
Skylark Skylark is a male United States Skylark is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

^That's why I did it. Some people seem to be forgetting parts or need a related quote.
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Hmm, The official timeline reminds me alot of my original theory. The Rejected Hero of Time.

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Old 12-14-2008, 09:05 PM
Smallville Boy 69 Mexico Smallville Boy 69 is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skylark View Post
-Now, you might ask. "Why is Sky trying to tell us of all his awesome exploits in the making of this article?" The answer is that the awards are coming up soon, and I want you to be reminded of them
That's the reason why some people were opened alot of unecesary and old info threads since one week ago.
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Old 12-14-2008, 09:08 PM
Skylark Skylark is a male United States Skylark is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

It's true, I am part of the problem on this one.
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Hmm, The official timeline reminds me alot of my original theory. The Rejected Hero of Time.

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Old 12-14-2008, 09:09 PM
Pinecove Pinecove is a male Canada Pinecove is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Nice Skylark.

I'd talk more ut the Polar express is back on TV. Gotta go.
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Old 12-14-2008, 09:30 PM
Missing Inaction Missing Inaction is a male United States Missing Inaction is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Nice.

And by the way, the whole idea of Ganon's soul being placed in the trident in OoX was mine. Yeah.
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Old 12-14-2008, 09:49 PM
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Well I had the idea as well Ollathir.

I was the one who interpreted the vessel being the Trident BEFORE the translations came.
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Old 12-14-2008, 09:57 PM
Skylark Skylark is a male United States Skylark is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollathir View Post
Nice.

And by the way, the whole idea of Ganon's soul being placed in the trident in OoX was mine. Yeah.
notice how I said it started with a debate with you? It started with us talking about when it became soulbound. I figured if it was soulbound it would explain FSA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinecove View Post
Well I had the idea as well Ollathir.

I was the one who interpreted the vessel being the Trident BEFORE the translations came.
I didn't even know of you when Ollathir and I had the debate that spawned all this. Do you mean the ooX translations? or the FSA ones?
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Hmm, The official timeline reminds me alot of my original theory. The Rejected Hero of Time.

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Old 12-14-2008, 09:59 PM
Missing Inaction Missing Inaction is a male United States Missing Inaction is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skylark View Post
notice how I said it started with a debate with you? It started with us talking about when it became soulbound. I figured if it was soulbound it would explain FSA.
Oh...sorry. Missed it.
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Old 12-14-2008, 11:35 PM
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

An analysis truly worthy of the upcoming best theorist!

Great work.
This will be good to look over when discussing/debating Ganon in the future.
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Old 12-15-2008, 01:52 AM
ravenrue ravenrue is a male Antarctica ravenrue is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skylark View Post
Now this leaves us with the question of what is a "ja-ki." Jumbie, a well known translator for the Zelda community believe it meant "tool or device" essentially being the ancient demon's weapon. However, Prime Blue, another translator insisted it meant "vessel." This is supported by other quotes in FSA relating to the trident.
I like everything being said, but I personally don't agree.

Quote:
The Flames of Sorrow, Destruction and Despair burn brightly. The return of the Evil King Ganon approaches. Our sacrifice of Zelda is all that remains! When we call Ganon's spirit into the vessel, it will be done! You can't stop us! Prepare to meet your doom!

...

Ganon's return was but a step away! Link! It is not over! Our rites have failed, but by sacrificing this body, Ganon will return! And you will be destroyed! Eee hee hee hee! Gwoh hoh hoh... Gwah hah hah... Destroy...all... Kill ALL!!! Gwoh hoh hoh! I am Ganon... The Evil King...
I personally think that Zelda was meant to only be the sacrifice and not the vessel. She was needed to be killed to bring back Ganon in his full glory (just like in AoL, Link's blood needed to be the sacrifice and have his blood sprinkled on Ganon's Ashes. Though, that could just be a tall tail spread among the leftover followers of Ganon so that they would still do his bidding. No proof on this though)

Proof of Zelda as JUST a sacrifice is when Twinrova says, "by sacrificing this body, Ganon will return!" That means that Ganon needs a sacrifice and to look into the information as if they are the vessel can be misleading.

Though It's possible that the Trident is the vessel, I don't think it is true for OoX. I think another way to think about this is like in the anime Bleach. They use a gigai. ( Gigai - Bleach Wiki ). I use this as an example because it is possible that Ganon's vessel was a body that looked like his.

But the last part of the quote is what I am having issues with. Ganon doesn't mind killing, but he seems to going on as if he were a mindless beast, only able to say I am the Evil King Ganon. Ganon doesn't just want to destroy all and kill all. That would defeat his purpose of lusting over power. Without lowly subjects or a world to rule, he can't gain his desire to be the dark ruler. As proof of his desires it says so in the end of WW. Here watch ( YouTube - The Legend of Zelda Wind Waker Ending Part 1 ). Stated in ZI, it is quoted, "The 3 Triforce pieces leave Link, Zelda and Ganon's hands, and assemble in the air. Ganondorf walks towards the completed Triforce and tries to touch it. He asks for Hyrule to be exposed to the sun once more, and to be given to him. " ( http://www.zeldainformer.com/z10tww/storylineguide.php )

So I believe that the Ganon in OoX is just a mindless raging beast. A souless vessel because of a failed summoning. It was intended to have Zelda die, but Twinrova sacrificed herself instead. This is like baking, you can't substitute strawberry flavoring with grape flavoring. Well you can, but it won't be the same. It would turn out to be something completely different. (who's heard of grape flavored cake anyways???)

Well that's it. I'm sure i'll get shot down, but It's hard to accept the Trident as the intended vessel. But I love the article.
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Last Edited by ravenrue; 12-15-2008 at 01:59 AM. Reason: Reply With Quote
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Old 12-15-2008, 03:18 AM
Average Gamer Average Gamer is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

My thoughts on the subject:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Me
The trident was something that Ganon summoned (and frequently got rid of) in OoX, not something that he was placed into. Twinrova clearly sacrifices herself and turns her body into the vessel for Ganon (technically, she becomes blue fire, which then becomes Ganon). A Japanese translator has also recently discovered that Nintendo has a habit of using the grander form of a word in favor of a more specific one. With that in mind, it's clear that Zelda was the intended "yoshiro", even when the proper term would be "yorimashi". She was going to be sacrificed, and then her body would have become Ganon's, as we see happen with Twinrova. "Yoshiro" also tend to be human bodies or human-shaped.

I'd also like to mention that Ganon only uses the trident for two attacks in OoX, and it's possible to never see him use it. Because of this, I doubt that the trident was meant to be important.

I'd also like to point out that many translations (that I've found) regarding the FSA trident only refer to it as a device, not a vessel. Seeing as how FSA Ganondorf was a greedy person who willingly picked up a trident that said "If you're blatantly evil and want to mess stuff up, use this," he probably didn't get taken over by anything at all. He was just a destructive SOB.
You did a good job of organizing the thread though.
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:31 AM
Skylark Skylark is a male United States Skylark is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

@AG
I will admit, Ganon doesn't seem to that careful with the trident, however that might be because he is mindless, and after FSA the trident no longer houses his soul.

While it is not stated the trident is the vessel, OoX offers the only event that we see than can explain FSA.

@ravenrue
Well, when looking at twinrova sacrifice herself. Her body turns into Ganon. So I don't think that can be the vessel. The sacrifice seems to recreate his body. Since they do not have a body for him already, I think they needed a temporary storage for it, the trident. But since Twinrova died, they were not able to recombine them into one. (assuming Ganon lived after his fight with Link)

But thanks both of you on the positive feedback, even though you don't agree.
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Hmm, The official timeline reminds me alot of my original theory. The Rejected Hero of Time.

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Old 12-15-2008, 11:51 AM
Thanatos-Zero Thanatos-Zero is a male Germany Thanatos-Zero is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Although it is a pretty nice theorie, but it kinda disgusts me that there are two Ganondorf around. For me I would like to have it, that in the trident was a part of Ganonsdorf´s soul ( think about horkruxs and phylacterys) alongside with his former power, while the rest the mainsoul is reincarnated in a new body.
Anyway neither mine, nor your theories are wrong. It can be that way or this way.
All what we need is a confirmation by Nintendo.

Well, if I think about it, why can´t Shigeru Miyamoto visit a Zelda homepage, like Keiji Inafune did it with a Megaman related homepage to answer questions by the user?
http://www.capcomdigital.com/blog/20...your_questions
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Old 12-15-2008, 04:15 PM
Erimgard Erimgard is a male Mexico Erimgard is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollathir View Post
And by the way, the whole idea of Ganon's soul being placed in the trident in OoX was mine. Yeah.
Actually, it was Flagship's

Skylark:
PM ME MAH BOI. About this article
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Old 01-07-2009, 10:43 PM
Skylark Skylark is a male United States Skylark is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Then what do you suppose the spirit in the trident is?
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Even if we were to be enslaved in the galaxy's cycle of rebirth, the feelings that were left behind will open the door! Even if the infinite universe were to go against us, our burning blood will cut through fate! We'll break through heavens and dimensions! We'll show you our path through force! WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK WE ARE!?

Hmm, The official timeline reminds me alot of my original theory. The Rejected Hero of Time.

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Old 01-07-2009, 11:02 PM
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caulaincourt View Post
Could be anything. Could be nothing. Could be a metaphor. Who knows?

I had always thought the Zuna made the trident.
the japanese translations state it is either the tool of an ancient demon, or it is the vessel for one. the word had multiple translations.

It is never stated that the Zuna made it.
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Even if we were to be enslaved in the galaxy's cycle of rebirth, the feelings that were left behind will open the door! Even if the infinite universe were to go against us, our burning blood will cut through fate! We'll break through heavens and dimensions! We'll show you our path through force! WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK WE ARE!?

Hmm, The official timeline reminds me alot of my original theory. The Rejected Hero of Time.

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Old 01-08-2009, 06:52 AM
Smertios Smertios is a male Brazil Smertios is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Article or not, i'll deal with this thread the same way i deal with all other threads: by multi-quoting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skylark View Post
Now this leaves us with the question of what is a "ja-ki." Jumbie, a well known translator for the Zelda community believe it meant "tool or device" essentially being the ancient demon's weapon. However, Prime Blue, another translator insisted it meant "vessel." This is supported by other quotes in FSA relating to the trident.

If the trident is a vessel for a spirit. It would mean that Ganondorf was the man who took up the spirit housed in the trident, allowing him to become the King of Darkness.
The problem is that it's way easier for the trident to be referred as a weapon then a vessel.

Quote:
During the Resurrection attempt of OoX, Twinrova states they will summon Ganon's spirit into "the vessel." This was originally thought to be Zelda, as she was the sacrifice. However, when Twinrova sacrifices herself, she vanishes. This leads to the idea that the sacrifice was just used to recreate Ganon's body. If that is the case, what is the "vessel?"
This quote from the Japanese helps show that the vessel and the sacrifice are two different things.
well, as people have said already, considering it was necessary to put the soul into the yorishiro for the ressurection, it's better to assume that the yorishiro is what got Ganon his new body, not some weapon he uses during the fight. But all we can do is assume consodering none of that is stated per se in FSA.


Quote:
A yorishiro is a inanimate object that is used to hold a spirit. It literally means "approach substitute." Given the information from FSA, we can accurately conclude that the yorishiro is the trident.
Wrong. A yorishiro can be an animatet body as well. As well as living beings. In japan one of the most common types of yorishiro is a tree.

Also, you can't conclude that accurately based on assumptions.

Quote:
Therefore, after Link defeats Ganon in OoX his spirit lived on in the trident, as it resided there instead of in the body. Ganon rested until the trident was claimed by a new Gerudo (conviently named Ganondorf) in FSA. In which he took the same form as his predecessor and seemed to become him all together.
How on earth would the body be soulless during the fight?

Quote:
In Alltp, Ganon carelessly throws the trident away midfight. I believe this is because inhabiting a new body renders the trident useless, as it is no longer the vessel.
Or because the trident is a mere weapon, as it was always meant to be. If we are assuming stuff, we should assume the easiest things so that assumptions don't influence the theory. Good theories are not based on assumptions, but on facts. If you base your stories on assumptions, you are writing a fanfic, not developing theory. This is why a timeline based off the trident is weak.

Quote:
- This also I think gets rid of the idea of the FSA Ganondorf being a reincarnation of the previous one, as his soul is in the trident. The only exception is if you believe that Ganondorf and Ganon have different souls.
The quote that states that Ganon's soul was in the trident is kind of ambiguous... Ganon himself could be sealed there.

Quote:
-Now, you might ask. "Why is Sky trying to tell us of all his awesome exploits in the making of this article?" The answer is that the awards are coming up soon, and I want you to be reminded of them
Bad idea, this only brings a lot of old theories back and get the theorizing forum a mess... Anyway, good article...

And one question: doesn't FSA states that the trident was constructed by an ancient tribe?? The same one that built the pyramid i suppose...
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Old 01-08-2009, 09:32 AM
Golgoth Golgoth is a male United States Golgoth is offline
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Re: Analysis of the Trident of Power

Cool. I personally thought that LoZ Ganon went first, & he created the Trident from his Malice, imbuing it with his power.
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