Fierce Deity origins?

[Coolface]

Ok, I'm not sure if I'm missing something here, but to me fierce deity link and who he actually is is all but a mystery to me.

The first thing i noticed, is that he heavily resembles the sheika. For one, his tall stature. The adults in majora's mask are up to his shoulders at best, he is not the same size as adult link from OOT. His white hair, the face paint, all trademarks of sheika. So the first conclusion i came to is that fierce deity is perhap's links sheika ancestor who protected the royal family in the past.

Another theory i had, which kind of disturbed me. It bounces off of another theory since the game never specificially states this.

(From the game)

it is an accursed item from legend that is said to have been used by an ancient tribe in its hexing rituals. It is said that an evil and wicked power is bestowed upon the one who wears that mask. According to legend... the troubles caused by Majora's Mask were so great... the ancient ones, fearing such catastrophe, sealed the mask in shadow forever, preventing its misuse. But now, that tribe from the legend has vanished, so no one really knows the true nature of the mask's power...

Majora's mask is able to incarnate itself at the end of the game, it gives itself a body. I think it's safe to assume that "Majora" is an entity on it's own. It wasn't always a mask, maybe a godlike creature. The standing theory states this:

There are two theories about the origin of Majora's Mask. One theory is that a very powerful, perhaps godlike, entity was sealed in Majora's Mask (or his essence was). This wicked godlike person did much evil, so he was sealed in a mask. Perhaps the Four Giants did this, or a tribe of powerful protectors - the "ancient ones." This theory explains how the mask is able to act on its own: the mask contains an essence so strong that it can act on its own, and control the wearer. And as Link battles the mask, the entity inside it is cast out, and forced to incarnate itself.

So majora, was an entity, or a being, by this theory, sealed into the mask. "Perhaps the Four Giants did this, or a tribe of powerful protectors - the "ancient ones.""

- Here's an alternate idea. What if, who we know of as fierce deity link, or oni link, IS this person who originally sealed majora inside of the mask? Perhaps, he is the link from that time period.

Now, seeing as though these events in question (majora being sealed into the mask) must have happened a great deal of time before the events of OOT (since the word ANCIENT TRIBE is used, after majora is already sealed in the mask, and seeing as how MM only occured 1-2 years after OOT)

So given that Oni/Fierce Deity link (by assumption) sealed Majora into the mask, and given that these events happened before - presumably several hundred years before the evens of OOT...is it safe to say

That Fierce Deity link, is the original hero of time?

Could the sealing of Majora into the mask be the first step of a multiple timeline-theory?

Another fact that supports this idea is that Fierce Deity link, by far, is the most powerful version of link in any of the games.

This brings up more interesting points. Although it's accepted by almost everyone that there is more than one link, most people assume that the OOT link is the original hero of time, and the events in the wind waker supports this. Although this link may have been the original link to save hyrule and defeat ganon, he was the second to defeat Majora.

Perhaps, all of these links, are the decendants of the ancient fierce deity link. Perhaps, the original quest, of the original hero of time, was the sealing of majora into the mask.

The idea that the fierce deity mask is an unlockable in the game, right before the fight with majora's mask also supports this. How seamless is the idea, that majora's incarnation is defeated once again, by no other than the original hero who sealed it in the mask in the first place?

Discuss, i like the idea. Perhaps not very innovative or plausible to you, but something to think about nonetheless.

[Aralith]

There seems to be a lot of speculation there. The theory that I've comfortably stuck with for a while now about Fierce Deity is that he is Link's Terminian counterpart. Everyone in Hyrule has a mirror in Termina, except for Link. Now why would this be? He may transcend time, but he cannot transcend space. Thus, the Hero of Time must also have a Terminian counterpart. Fierce Deity is a very plausible option for Link's mirror.

[Coolface]

Actually, my opinion on link's terminian counterpart is given in-game.

I think that link's terminian counterpart is the deku-butler's son.

List of characters in The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The deku butler says that link reminds him of his son. We can assume that the twisted sprout that tatl points out between hyrule and termina is his son, as he is seen kneeling next to it at the ending credits, right at the end.

He (the son of the deku-butler who's name is not given) is killed by majora's mask just before link enters termina, and link is cursed within his form right before he enters termina. Link takes his place in termina. Link approaches termina - Deku son is killed - Link is cursed with the form of the deku son - link enters termina. Just seems too perfect. He takes his place in termina. Also, the deku shell when elegy of emptiness is played resembles the twisted sprout seen at the beginning so much...well, it's just uncanny.

[Erimgard]

Originally Posted by Coolface

Actually, my opinion on link's terminian counterpart is given in-game.

I think that link's terminian counterpart is the deku-butler's son.
The deku butler says that link reminds him of his son.

Pretty sure he only says that if you're in your Deku form...in which case you pretty much ARE his son. You're wearing his spirit as a mask.

[Aralith]

Originally Posted by Coolface

Actually, my opinion on link's terminian counterpart is given in-game.

I think that link's terminian counterpart is the deku-butler's son.

List of characters in The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The deku butler says that link reminds him of his son. We can assume that the twisted sprout that tatl points out between hyrule and termina is his son, as he is seen kneeling next to it at the ending credits, right at the end.

He (the son of the deku-butler who's name is not given) is killed by majora's mask just before link enters termina, and link is cursed within his form right before he enters termina. Link takes his place in termina. Link approaches termina - Deku son is killed - Link is cursed with the form of the deku son - link enters termina. Just seems too perfect. He takes his place in termina. Also, the deku shell when elegy of emptiness is played resembles the twisted sprout seen at the beginning so much...well, it's just uncanny.

Um I agree with all of the above except where you said that the Deku Scrub is Link's counterpart. It is nothing more than the spirit that is in the mask he wears that allows him to transform. Notice that you are in Deku Scrub form when the butler mentions that you remind him of his son. This is because you pretty much are his son at that point, and he notices both the physical and spiritual resemblance. To say that the Deku Scrub is Link's mirror would be on par with saying that the spirit of the Goron Mask (cannot think of his name right now for the life of me) is Link's counterpart when it is clearly Darunia's. Now, whose counterpart the Deku Scrub is is a question that will probably never be answered, as you never really converse with the Deku Scrubs in Hyrule. But I can pretty much assure you that it's not Link's. Why would his counterpart be of a different species?

[Coolface]

That's the only case of that in the game though, every other form (mikau, darmani) everyone mistakes you for that original person.

Besides, it still doesn't contradict the fact that link essentially takes his place as soon as he enters termina.

While i would agree that there is a terminian counterpart to link, I don't see any evidence as to why it would be fierce deity. Fierce deity has an ancient look to him, and he is completely different from present day link, while every other terminian counterpart is almost identical to their hyrule counter part. There just isn't anything that supports it besides "he's the the only character left".

My opinion for link's counterpart isn't very sound, but neither is the assertion that fierce deity is the counterpart. Nonetheless, that isn't the point of the topic. Undermining the theory that oni-link is the original hero of time is going to need alot more than "link needs a terminian counterpart and oni-link is the only character left so i pick him on that basis alone"

Do you see what I'm saying? It's perfectly logical to assume that link has a counterpart, but the blind conjecture that it is fierce deity does not even come close to contradicting my original theory.

Why would his counterpart be of a different species?

Why would his counterpart be a wooden mask - containing a spirit of someone obviously not from that time period or even close?

[Aralith]

That's certainly not the only reason I pick him, though it does lend itself to the theory. I also believe it because there is some physical resemblance between Link and Fierce Deity. Granted, FD is an adult, whereas Link is a child, but the similarity is still there. Also, no one said that the people have to be exactly the same. Take Anju for instance. While her physical features are identical to her Terminian mirror, their character is very different.

In Hyrule, Anju is careless, joyful, and easily excited.

In Termina, she is forgetful, depressed, and calm.

So, if character traits can be different, why not physical ones? Also, I have an example of a physical difference in mirrors. Kafei does not seem to have a Hylian counterpart, yet we know he must. He appears as though he might be a Sheikah, as he has red eyes. The only two Shiekah we meet in OoT are Impa (a female), and Shiek, someone who looks nothing like Kafei. And whether Shiek should even count is debatable. So whoever Kafei's Hyrule mirror is, it certainly doesn't look like him, else we'd know who it was.

This being the case, Link shares both physical and character traits with Fierce Diety. As stated before, they do have similar appearance, despite their obvious age and size differences. They also have a similar sword style. If you look carefully, how FD wields his double-handed sword is very similar to how Adult Link wields Biggoron's Sword in OoT. I consider this a character trait as fighting style is very much based on how one perceives the world, and therefore their character outlook. Also, FD leads with his left hand, a trait that every Link in every Zelda game ever has shared (with the exception of Wii version of Twilight Princess and the right facing Link sprites in the early 2D games, as this was part of a mirroring effect). Also, the way that FD is depicted in the manga is similar to Link. Now, I know that the manga isn't canon, but I think that in this example it shows the intent of the creators to have similarities between Link and FD.

As you can see, there are several reasons that Link and FD make good counterparts, and these reasons are why I believe what I do.

[Coolface]

Originally Posted by Aralith

This being the case, Link shares both physical and character traits with Fierce Diety. As stated before, they do have similar appearance, despite their obvious age and size differences. They also have a similar sword style. If you look carefully, how FD wields his double-handed sword is very similar to how Adult Link wields Biggoron's Sword in OoT. I consider this a character trait as fighting style is very much based on how one perceives the world, and therefore their character outlook. Also, FD leads with his left hand, a trait that every Link in every Zelda game ever has shared (with the exception of Wii version of Twilight Princess and the right facing Link sprites in the early 2D games, as this was part of a mirroring effect). Also, the way that FD is depicted in the manga is similar to Link. Now, I know that the manga isn't canon, but I think that in this example it shows the intent of the creators to have similarities between Link and FD.

As you can see, there are several reasons that Link and FD make good counterparts, and these reasons are why I believe what I do.

All of this supports my theory as well, since all of the hero's of time shared all of these things too. In fact, I'd say it better supports my theory since you have the OOT/MM link and oni link similarities going for you, whilst i have all of the similarities of all of the heros of time, including oni link going for me.

Think about it. You say the fact that oni link and OOT/MM link share appearances and left-handedness supports the idea that they are counterparts.

Doesn't it also support the idea that oni link was a hero of time as well? Of course it does, since you would agree that there is more than one hero of time, and they all share these things that you pointed out.

[Xeves]

This is a post from my forum that i made that really relates to this topic, check it out and the forum cause i need more ideas for the plot of it Idea for the next Zelda game i just made up, your thoughts? :

(also this is a plot to add on to my idea for the game's villain)

"and on my idea of the villain being the revamped version of dark link looking like fierce diety link could work under the terms that Link is not just a reborn form of the hero of time, but another darker being that was link's termina form (who is fierce diety link in my opinion) and that these two somehow intertwine in the Twilight princess link (yes this is supposed to be a sequel to twilight princess, unless you disagree with that notion) though the process of rebirth and link holds both of them inside him, and this darker entity eventually bursts out of him in this idea. And this game could also play into the background of majora's mask, since many theories suggest that fierce deity link fought majora in the past (in the universe of termina). but who says it was for the good of the world? what if they were rivals? OH! plot twist!

Obviously I'm going to get alot of criticism on my alternate universe statement saying that "termina is in the world of hyrule and the hero of time, how do you explain skull kid saying 'You smell like the fairy kid who taught me that song in the woods'". well ill tell you how, ALTERNATE UNIVERSE. that event could have transpired in a different context, and link's smell could be coincidental.

Basically this version of dark link/fierce deity link would far surpass the evil of ganon/dorf in my opinion.

And also, this is now currently a sequel to twilight princess AND majora's mask! yay!

Plus, couldn't this possibly make for the creepiest and darkest Zelda game yet?"

[Aralith]

Originally Posted by Coolface

All of this supports my theory as well, since all of the hero's of time shared all of these things too. In fact, I'd say it better supports my theory since you have the OOT/MM link and oni link similarities going for you, whilst i have all of the similarities of all of the heros of time, including oni link going for me.

Think about it. You say the fact that oni link and OOT/MM link share appearances and left-handedness supports the idea that they are counterparts.

Doesn't it also support the idea that oni link was a hero of time as well? Of course it does, since you would agree that there is more than one hero of time, and they all share these things that you pointed out.

The only time a reference is ever, and I repeat, EVER made to multiple Heroes of Time (remember, not all Links are HoT, WW Link was the Hero of Winds) are the fact that in OoT, Shiek tells Link that, "standing there, you look just like the legendary Hero of Time." Other than that, no, there are no other references to other Heroes of Time. And I can still chalk Shiek's comment up to there being a reference to the Hero of Time wearing green in the legends somewhere or something like that. There is certainly no conclusive evidence that other Heroes of Time exist.

In fact, the fact that all Links share traits with Fierce Diety is in credit to my theory. Because Termina and Hyrule will (assumed) exist next to each other for all time, unless one or the other is destroyed, which as far as we know, has never happened. So it's a fair bet that Termina is a parallel world to Hyrule all the way until ALttP. That being the case, each Link would need his own counterpart. Since Fierce Deity was turned into a mask, he now transcends time and will exist forever, so he is the counterpart of all Hylian Links.

Edit: To JamesCava, you really ought to say that stuff in PM (I swear I'm not modding, I'm just suggesting), as it really detracts from the topic when you interject stuff like that.

[Shæde]

He is a demi-god of similar power to Majora
His power was contained within a mask

[Aralith]

Originally Posted by Shæde

He is a demi-god of similar power to Majora
His power was contained within a mask

I sincerely hope you have evidence to back that up. 'Twould be a shame to see such a promising hypothesis go to waste.

[langford]

I could be wrong, but here are my two cents until I change my mind. Every mask I remember at the moment is acquired after Link helps somebody or heals their soul. Whoever those little kids in the moon are supposed to represent, Link gets the mask by playing with them and giving away his masks. The kids live in Majora's mind, seem to have Skull Kid's loneliness problems, and Happy Mask Salesman's interest in collecting Masks. If the kids are Majora, then it may be that Mojora has taken parts of SK and HMS to fill the voids in it's own being. That might imply that the Fierce Deity is Majora's truer form, or that the Fierce Deity Mask is the combined power of everyone the mask has been associated with.

[Minos Yewman]

Who says that FD is a good guy? If what screenshot's I have seen are correct, it says something like: "Could this mask be as evil as Magora's Mask?" I think that FD was Link's counterpart but chose the path of evil instead. That was why Link was sent to Termina: To help the people who were about to be crushed by the moon because their own hero had deserted them.

[Stuit]

I don't think there's any real origin to the mask. It's just something Majora pulled out of his imagination, like the rest of the moonworld.

[Aralith]

Originally Posted by Minos Yewman

Who says that FD is a good guy? If what screenshot's I have seen are correct, it says something like: "Could this mask be as evil as Magora's Mask?" I think that FD was Link's counterpart but chose the path of evil instead. That was why Link was sent to Termina: To help the people who were about to be crushed by the moon because their own hero had deserted them.

You ought to see this then.

The Message of Majora's Mask

That should explain any questions you have about MM or FD or Majora or Stone why Link was there. Though its obviously just a theory, a lot of it is based on really good solid evidence. In fact, much of it is based on imagery from the game, so it's very well defended. You really should check it out.