OOT is not the imprisoning war in ALTTP, and I think ALTTP happens after TP

[Son_michael]

I always see people reference OOT as the original prequel to ALTTP before developers changed there mind or whatever, but thats not possible.


In ALTTP,the back story states the knights of Hyrule fought and died to protect the seven wise men so that the wise men could seal ganon away in the sacred realm/dark world.

In the Adult timeline of OOT all the knights are dead as is the king, the 7 sages seal ganon away to the sacred realm...but they do so after the triforce was broken and Ganon never got a wish


In ALTTP ganon is sealed away and gets the triforce and makes his wish...which transforms the sacred realm into the dark world


In ALTTP its stated Link is the last descendant of the bloodline of hylian knights


in OOT Adult timeline....there was no hylian knights for link to join


In ALTTP,Hylian is an ancient language and everyone's mostly human


In OOT everyones hylian




so we can see the games are very different and the ALTTP back story does not match with the events of OOT.....so this is my idea




in OOT child timeline, Link returns from Termina and becomes a knight of Hyrule, he then starts a family and thus the bloodline thats spoken of in ALTTP is born...and it has to start with OOT because remember in OOT link is an orphan...so the bloodline starts there


TP happens 100 years later and the events of TP have nothing to do with the IW mentioned in ALTTP


Now after TP is when the triforce becomes whole again,during this time someway or another ganondorf comes back and attempts to break into the sacred realm to steal the triforce....think of this ganon dorf as a reincarnation with the determination not to fail like he did in his past life.

so now the seven wise men who are descendants of the TP sages{since we know in the child timeline the OOT sages dont exist} are called by the king to help take care of ganon dorf.

now the events of ALTTP backstory happen, the knights of hyrule engage in a war against ganon dorfs dark monsters while Ganon dorf once again broke into the sacred realm to obtain the Triforce.....in desperation the seven wise men combined all there power and created an unbreakable seal....forever sealing ganondorf inside the sacred realm


Ganon dorf proceeded to touch the triforce and made the sacred realm his own realm,he no longer had an unbalanced heart like long ago..so now after all the preparation and experience..he had everything it took to completley master the triforce

Due to the immense power ganon dorf created...portals began opening in hyrule to the dark world{sacred realm} it was through these portals that he was able to send a part of himself through the void and posses the human wizard known as agnahim,using the wizard ganon dorf built up enough power to posses humans as referenced in ALTTP when you talk to the guard at the top of the castle"ever since agnahim came, everyone started behaving strangely...I suppose its just a matter of time before I become affected too"




Now im not going to explain ALTTP cause we all know how it ends but I also want to point out the master sword looks to be in the same woods in TP as in ALTTP so that could be further confirmation ALTTP is after TP in the child timeline


so there's my theory on where ALTTP is and hopefully ive proven OOT is not the IW which was mentioned in ALTTP



now I know alot of people here love to think of OOT as the imprisoning war and your going to argue your point fiercly....but remember were all friends here

[Stevie78]

IM CONFUSED!!!

[Erimgard]

OoT was developed to be the IW. That is not debatable.
Whether it still is the IW is debatable.

There are inconsistencies, but that's likely due to Shigeru not really giving much thought to the general timeline, and giving OoT a better plot than the IW.
The IW would make a boring game, so OoT keeps most of the same concepts, and makes it much better for gameplay.

[Son_michael]

Originally Posted by Erimgard

OoT was developed to be the IW. That is not debatable.
Whether it still is the IW is debatable.

There are inconsistencies, but that's likely due to Shigeru not really giving much thought to the general timeline, and giving OoT a better plot than the IW.
The IW would make a boring game, so OoT keeps most of the same concepts, and makes it much better for gameplay.

why is it not debatable?


the IW is completley different than OOT and there's quite a bit of evidence linking TP to ALTTP so....

[Goronlove7]

Well what if a Knight did survive like the guy who collects poe's I had a weird feeling he was a knight. Or more likely zelda hired new knight starting the blood line. :p

[Erimgard]

Originally Posted by Son_michael

why is it not debatable?


the IW is completley different than OOT and there's quite a bit of evidence linking TP to ALTTP so....

Because the game designer themselves have said that when they made it, they were told they had to make it follow the IW story.

Below are comments from two staff members of the OoT development team; one from the Character Designer, Satoru Takizawa, and one from the Script Director, Toru Osawa. In this interview, conducted at the time of OoT's release by the Japanese website Ki no ue no Himitsu kichi and translated by Zethar-II[5], Takizawa confirms that they were dealing with ALttP's Imprisoning War (also known as the Seal War) when designing OoT's story, and thus was meant to be the account of the seven Sages' seal on the Sacred Realm in that backstory.

Takizawa: In past, when you thought about Ganon in Zelda, he was a pig. This time, when were collaborating ideas, we thought "He wouldn't be a pig, would he?" There were even some who thought "I don't want him to be a pig." But I still thought that at least the end should have Ganon as a pig. The whole time I wanted to know what Mr. Miyamoto thought, but in the end, I realized that Mr. Miyamoto didn't have an opinion on the matter, so I decided to do it the way I wanted.

This time, the story really wasn't an original. We were dealing with the "The Imprisoning War of the Seven Sages" from the SNES edition Zelda. To give that game a little "secret" recognition, I thought that keeping the "pigness" in Ganon would be the correct course. So we made him a beast "with the feeling of a pig."

Osawa then states that the Sages' names in OoT later become the basis for the town names in AoL (though in reality, the Sages were actually named in reference to the towns themselves as a throwback to that game, as was the case with Talon and Malon, and their similarity to Tarin and Marin from LA).

Osawa: Though in this game Zelda is now included in the Seven Sages, the other six have the names of the town names from the Disk System edition "The Adventure of Link."

In the SNES edition game, the story "Long ago, there was a war called the Imprisoning War" was passed along. A name in the Imprisoning War era is the name of a Town later. They were like "pseudo-secrets." We wanted to throw these out through the entirety of the game. That thing from then is now this.

I'm sure there are other quotes too, but those were the ones I found right away.


And why would OoT Link have to become a Knight? All we know is that aLttP Link is descended from the Knights. Nothing says he has to be related to OoT Link.

[Son_michael]

Originally Posted by Goronlove7

Well what if a Knight did survive like the guy who collects poe's I had a weird feeling he was a knight. Or more likely zelda hired new knight starting the blood line. :p

in the child timeline that knight would have never gone evil


and in the adult timeline that knight became evil...so he's not a knight anymore..

[Son_michael]

Originally Posted by Erimgard

Because the game designer themselves have said that when they made it, they were told they had to make it follow the IW story.



I'm sure there are other quotes too, but those were the ones I found right away.

that quote only says how they were going to do the IW....they obviously didn't because again OOT has nothing to do with the IW

And why would OoT Link have to become a Knight? All we know is that aLttP Link is descended from the Knights. Nothing says he has to be related to OoT Link.

it seems only logical that Link from ALTTP would be descended from the legendary hero and not just a famous group of knights

[Hombre de Mundo]

OoT never quite fit with the description of the IW, because Ganondorf got sealed in the SR with only the ToP. Then he suddenly aquired all of it in AlttP. This doens't work out at all unless some schmuck decided to throw the ToC and ToW in the Sacred Realm for no good reason.

Though at the time, there were no other options, really. It was as obvious as the split is now. Even though OoT - ALttP didn't really work.

[langford]

Originally Posted by Son_michael

I always see people reference OOT as the original prequel to ALTTP before developers changed there mind or whatever, but thats not possible.


In ALTTP,the back story states the knights of Hyrule fought and died to protect the seven wise men so that the wise men could seal ganon away in the sacred realm/dark world.

In the Adult timeline of OOT all the knights are dead as is the king, the 7 sages seal ganon away to the sacred realm...but they do so after the triforce was broken and Ganon never got a wish


In ALTTP ganon is sealed away and gets the triforce and makes his wish...which transforms the sacred realm into the dark world


In ALTTP its stated Link is the last descendant of the bloodline of hylian knights


in OOT Adult timeline....there was no hylian knights for link to join


In ALTTP,Hylian is an ancient language and everyone's mostly human


In OOT everyones hylian




so we can see the games are very different and the ALTTP back story does not match with the events of OOT.....so this is my idea




in OOT child timeline, Link returns from Termina and becomes a knight of Hyrule, he then starts a family and thus the bloodline thats spoken of in ALTTP is born...and it has to start with OOT because remember in OOT link is an orphan...so the bloodline starts there


TP happens 100 years later and the events of TP have nothing to do with the IW mentioned in ALTTP


Now after TP is when the triforce becomes whole again,during this time someway or another ganondorf comes back and attempts to break into the sacred realm to steal the triforce....think of this ganon dorf as a reincarnation with the determination not to fail like he did in his past life.

so now the seven wise men who are descendants of the TP sages{since we know in the child timeline the OOT sages dont exist} are called by the king to help take care of ganon dorf.

now the events of ALTTP backstory happen, the knights of hyrule engage in a war against ganon dorfs dark monsters while Ganon dorf once again broke into the sacred realm to obtain the Triforce.....in desperation the seven wise men combined all there power and created an unbreakable seal....forever sealing ganondorf inside the sacred realm


Ganon dorf proceeded to touch the triforce and made the sacred realm his own realm,he no longer had an unbalanced heart like long ago..so now after all the preparation and experience..he had everything it took to completley master the triforce

Due to the immense power ganon dorf created...portals began opening in hyrule to the dark world{sacred realm} it was through these portals that he was able to send a part of himself through the void and posses the human wizard known as agnahim,using the wizard ganon dorf built up enough power to posses humans as referenced in ALTTP when you talk to the guard at the top of the castle"ever since agnahim came, everyone started behaving strangely...I suppose its just a matter of time before I become affected too"




Now im not going to explain ALTTP cause we all know how it ends but I also want to point out the master sword looks to be in the same woods in TP as in ALTTP so that could be further confirmation ALTTP is after TP in the child timeline


so there's my theory on where ALTTP is and hopefully ive proven OOT is not the IW which was mentioned in ALTTP



now I know alot of people here love to think of OOT as the imprisoning war and your going to argue your point fiercly....but remember were all friends here

OOT Link is a knight of Hyrule. Whether there are others is questionable, but seven years of war pass that we don't see.

Look at the pedistal the Master Sword Rest in, its the same in OOT as in LTTP. Look at the pendants you collect to release the Mater Sword, same in OOT as LTTP.

The sages exist in both the Adult and Child timeline, they are simply different sages.

Ganondorf is imprisoned in the corrupted sacred realm in OOT, and is not in any other game. Ganondorf must be sealed in the corrupted sacred realm for LTTP to happen.

OOT was made after seven years of fans begging for more LTTP. Whether you like it or not, OOT is the backstory described in LTTP.

[Goronlove7]

in the child timeline that knight would have never gone evil


and in the adult timeline that knight became evil...so he's not a knight anymore..

I don't understand what did I say about turning evil?

[Erimgard]

Originally Posted by Son_michael

that quote only says how they were going to do the IW....they obviously didn't because again OOT has nothing to do with the IW

Did you read the whole thing?
They were talking about designing OoT
Yes there were inconsistencies, but as I said before they didn't think it would matter at the time because:
A: Shigeru has never really cared about the Timeline. He didn't have to make it consistent
B: It made for a much better story

And OoT has nothing to do with the IW?

Both feature Ganondorf touching the Triforce, turning into Ganon, making the Sacred Realm turn Evil, attacking Hyrule, and getting sealed by Seven Sages.

[Project 2501]

I've always wondered how they reconcile ALttP with the idea that anyone who has all three Triforce parts is basically God, especially given that they didn't change that in the GBA release.

[Son_michael]

Originally Posted by langford

OOT Link is a knight of Hyrule. Whether there are others is questionable, but seven years of war pass that we don't see.

he wasn't a knight of Hyrule in the adult timeline but he probably was in the child timeline


the thing is the IW has to be after TP cause everything would make sense

1.how ganon dorf claims the triforce

2.why ganon dorf is no longer with the gerudo

3.the triforce is split in OOT and TP yet in ALTTP backstory it was whole and remains whole after ganon touches it

Look at the pedistal the Master Sword Rest in, its the same in OOT as in LTTP. Look at the pendants you collect to release the Mater Sword, same in OOT as LTTP.

the pendants are different,the pendants are power,wisdom and courage where as the spiritual stones were elements

the pedestal is completley different,its just a white pedestal in OOT and iots in the TOT but in ALTTP the pedestal is surrounded by a white floor and its on a raised platform in the center

The sages exist in both the Adult and Child timeline, they are simply different sages.

yea and im saying the seven wise men are the descendants of the the different sages

Ganondorf is imprisoned in the corrupted sacred realm in OOT, and is not in any other game. Ganondorf must be sealed in the corrupted sacred realm for LTTP to happen.

I thought it was preety much common knowledge that link warned the king and thus ganon never got sealed....im saying ganon dorf comes back in the future and then gets sealed by the descendants of the TP sages

OOT was made after seven years of fans begging for more LTTP. Whether you like it or not, OOT is the backstory described in LTTP.

sorry,the games are completley different,if the developers really intended for OOT child timeline before TP to be the IW then they failed HARD when they made TP


it has to be after TP that the imprisoning war takes place

[langford]

Originally Posted by Son_michael

he wasn't a knight of Hyrule in the adult timeline but he probably was in the child timeline


the thing is the IW has to be after TP cause everything would make sense

1.how ganon dorf claims the triforce

2.why ganon dorf is no longer with the gerudo

3.the triforce is split in OOT and TP yet in ALTTP backstory it was whole and remains whole after ganon touches it




the pendants are different,the pendants are power,wisdom and courage where as the spiritual stones were elements

the pedestal is completley different,its just a white pedestal in OOT and iots in the TOT but in ALTTP the pedestal is surrounded by a white floor and its on a raised platform in the center



yea and im saying the seven wise men are the descendants of the the different sages



I thought it was preety much common knowledge that link warned the king and thus ganon never got sealed....im saying ganon dorf comes back in the future and then gets sealed by the descendants of the TP sages





sorry,the games are completley different,if the developers really intended for OOT child timeline before TP to be the IW then they failed HARD when they made TP


it has to be after TP that the imprisoning war takes place

Who says he isn't Gerudo in LTTP, they don't mention his race? The Gerudo wern't even fond of him in OOT.

The splitting of the triforce when touched is integral to the plot of OOT, not LTTP, WW, or any other game. If you discount LTTP over triforce behavior, you have to discount pretty much all games.

The pendants and the spiritual stones are the same, look at them and how they are used. "Pendant" is a generic word, and "spiritual stone" is a proper name.

The pedestal Is the raised platform, and it exist in every game that includes the Master Sword.

Are you basing your theory on the idea that there is no timeline split, or are you just ignoring that LTTP goes in the Adult timeline?

You have no basis to claim no similarity, especially if you are going to invent a game that doesn't exist to fill the huge gaps in your own theory.

[Erimgard]

Originally Posted by langford

Who says he isn't Gerudo in LTTP, they don't mention his race? The Gerudo wern't even fond of him in OOT.

Only Nabooru disliked him in OoT.
It was FSA where he was hated.

But he is specifically mentioned as Ganondorf [his Gerudo form/name] several times in the game.

[Son_michael]

Originally Posted by langford

Who says he isn't Gerudo in LTTP, they don't mention his race? The Gerudo wern't even fond of him in OOT.

they werent? he was there king and aside from the spirit sage everyone preety much followed his orders and were loyal to him

The splitting of the triforce when touched is integral to the plot of OOT, not LTTP, WW, or any other game. If you discount LTTP over triforce behavior, you have to discount pretty much all games.

the triforce is clearly split in some games but in ALTTP the triforce is WHOLE,if OOT was the bck story for ALTTP then the triforce should have remained whole after ganon dorf touched it

The pendants and the spiritual stones are the same, look at them and how they are used. "Pendant" is a generic word, and "spiritual stone" is a proper name.

there not the same...again the spiritual stones are elements the pendants are virtues represente din the 3 pieces of the triforce

The pedestal Is the raised platform, and it exist in every game that includes the Master Sword.

go play ALTTP, and then go play OOT.....I dont remember a big inscription written in Hylian about the hero recieving the master sword on cataclysims eve in the OOT version....and again the platforms are completley different

Are you basing your theory on the idea that there is no timeline split, or are you just ignoring that LTTP goes in the Adult timeline?

how the heck could it be in the adult timeline? that makes no sense at all

You have no basis to claim no similarity, especially if you are going to invent a game that doesn't exist to fill the huge gaps in your own theory.

who says the events of the imprisoning war has to be a game? im just trying to make sense and compensate for the huge gaps in the theory that OOT is the imprisoning war

[langford]

Originally Posted by Son_michael

they werent? he was there king and aside from the spirit sage everyone preety much followed his orders and were loyal to him

Can you name an example? I seem to remember Link gaining rights to roam through town.

Originally Posted by Son_michael

the triforce is clearly split in some games but in ALTTP the triforce is WHOLE,if OOT was the bck story for ALTTP then the triforce should have remained whole after ganon dorf touched it

Did you no know that LTTP was made before OOT was?

Originally Posted by Son_michael

there not the same...again the spiritual stones are elements the pendants are virtues represente din the 3 pieces of the triforce

Well if I name an object after a virtue, then it clearly can't be based on an element, even if it has the same appearance, same function, and an established trend in several games.
/sarcasm

Originally Posted by Son_michael

go play ALTTP, and then go play OOT.....I dont remember a big inscription written in Hylian about the hero recieving the master sword on cataclysims eve in the OOT version....and again the platforms are completley different

What you read there is pretty much irrelevant

Originally Posted by Son_michael

how the heck could it be in the adult timeline? that makes no sense at all

I'm going to have to assume you are playing dumb. This has been described to you a few time in this thread.

Originally Posted by Son_michael

who says the events of the imprisoning war has to be a game? im just trying to make sense and compensate for the huge gaps in the theory that OOT is the imprisoning war

You are attempting to create a narrative that duplicates the events in the OOT, which are the events required to set up LTTP. If you are going to create these narratives, the games can be placed in any order whatsoever.

[Son_michael]

Originally Posted by langford

Can you name an example? I seem to remember Link gaining rights to roam through town.

its specifically stated Ganon dorf is there king, Link gets the right to move through there town by tricking them into believing he's a thief...they dont realise link is ganon dorfs enemy

Did you no know that LTTP was made before OOT was?

so just retcon everything?


so are we supposed to see an official statement form nintendo int he future stating that the triforce actually did split and everything...just play ALTTP and enjoy iot but yeah...were retconning all the stuff we said so it fits with OOT/sarcasim

Well if I name an object after a virtue, then it clearly can't be based on an element, even if it has the same appearance, same function, and an established trend in several games.

they dont have the same appearence,in ALTTP there pendants that go around your neck, look at the menue and you can see the strings. In OOT there jewels

function is different,OOT the function is to open the door of time, in ALTTP the function is to be able to pull out the master sword

What you read there is pretty much irrelevant

irrelevant....? your saying there the same damm thing but there clearly not because OOT dosen't have that writing nor that whole extra floor with the raised platform

how is that irrelevant?

I'm going to have to assume you are playing dumb. This has been described to you a few time in this thread.

oh really? show me where in this thread it has been explained to me that ALTTP is in the adult timeline. The only time it was ever mentioned was when you asked me if I didn't think it wa sin the adult timeline

You are attempting to create a narrative that duplicates the events in the OOT, which are the events required to set up LTTP. If you are going to create these narratives, the games can be placed in any order whatsoever.

im attempting to make sense of the thngs stated in ALTTP, if they totally dont match up then they cant be the same

[Erimgard]

Son_Michael, since aLttP is after OoT sometime, is it really that unreasonable that the Spiritual Stones were made into Pendants?
I think it's quite clear that Nintendo intended for them to be the same. But that has no bearing on the timeline anyway, so I don't see why you're debating it.