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Old 07-14-2006, 09:32 PM
Master of ALttP United_States Master of ALttP is offline
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The importance of Hairiamoji

First off, if you came here to ask what the hell "Hairiamoji" is, then I'll answer that now. Hairiamoji is the Japanese name for Modern Hylian script, as seen in The Wind Waker. Now, seeing as people on GameFAQs see and treat Hairiamoji as crap, I thought I'd make this thread to gain support for it.

If you've been following the timeline debates recently here at ZU, then you'll notice that I've taken a liking to discussing the Hylian language. Hell, I've even changed my rank to "Master of Hairiamoji" because of it. Well, I am. I can transliterate just about any I find in a Zelda game. That is, if it's even legible. Tingle must have been high when he drew his map, and then drunk when he did the writing on it. Anyways, if we are to be discussing the timeline of the Zelda games, then the Hylian language cannot be overlooked. Sadly, however, most of you don't even give it a second thought. I am hoping to change this state of mind across the several forums I am a member of.

Anyways, people need to give more recognition to Hylian text in the Zelda games. Instead of saying that it's all just Easter eggs and that it wasn't meant to be translated, we need to accept it and what it means. I've worked my ass off for the past few days to find Hylian text and transliterate it into Japanese, so I think the least you all can do for me is appreciate it and the work I have put into it. Now, don't get me started on translating it. That's a hell of a job, and I'm glad that I've found someone who can handle that for me. Don't get me wrong, though! Transliterating this stuff is hard work!

Now, my biggest problem with people about Hairiamoji is that they see it as meaningless and that it has no meaning. Well, there's eighteen appearances of it in The Minish Cap, and I know the meaning of seventeen. It's not just random stuff, either. It all has meaning of some sort. Sure, some of it is just Easter eggs, but other material can be used in timeline discussion fairly well. However, people treat it all as Easter eggs. People dismiss the importance of the prescence of Hylian text, yet then rely on it in another instance. I am talking about the split timeline theorists of GameFAQs right now. They start off by using the translated Hylian from the intro of TWW for support of a split timeline, yet they go off to say that the Hylian text that I'm using is completely wortheless. However, many of you here at ZU have acknowledged my finds, and I thank you for it.

So, the point here is, Hylian text should be just as important in timeline discussion as in-game text, because it's surely in the game. It is absurd to be discussing the history of Hyrule and not even take into consideration one of the most important aspects of its history, which is the language. To do something like this is hypocritical for any timeline theorist. Well, just tell me if you agree or disagree with all this, and I'll check back on it. Hopefully we can convince the people of GameFAQs to take our opinions into consideration and persuade them that The Minish Cap does not take place before Ocarina of Time.
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Old 07-15-2006, 07:05 AM
Sentient Sentient is a male United Kingdom Sentient is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

I totally agree with you Master of ALttP. The Hylian text is part of what makes up Hyrule, so it's actually really important in timeline theories. If some Hylian text refers or mentions something from another game, then it helps place that game into a timeline. By the way, I fancy having a go at translating the Hylian text from Japanese to English, could you PM me a good Japanese to English translating website? Because I know how to change the Hylian into Japanese, just not the Japanese into English. All Hylian text should be taken as canon, because if it's in the game, and it's not an easter egg, then it's canon, and canon is what timeline theories are made up of.
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Old 07-15-2006, 07:09 AM
vacumgod United_States vacumgod is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

If the translations are revelant the yes, by all means, use it as source material, because it is in game, but it's also.. um.. looking to far into the game, I'm sure the developers don't think too much about it, sure they add their messages here and there, but I don't think there's going to be really important information hidden within MHS or AHS.
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Old 07-15-2006, 07:48 AM
LinkZeldaGanon United_States LinkZeldaGanon is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

I believe that stuff like the Japanese/Hylian writing you see in the games are just nice little extras the good people of NCL put in. They may carry a little weight, but I'm not about to base any major claims on it.
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Old 07-15-2006, 08:29 AM
Master of ALttP United_States Master of ALttP is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

I'm mostly talking about the text itself, not what it says. My biggest deal with it is that people on the GameFAQs boards don't give a Rupee about me finding Hairiamoji in The Minish Cap. They still place it before Ocarina of Time, which must have been done when they were both high and drunk. Anyways, I like the responses that I've gotten so far. I hope I can get some more.
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Old 07-15-2006, 09:52 AM
Klew United_States Klew is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

Sure, I agree too. I think the programmers know far more about the timeline and the structure of the story than anyone else except the director and producer(s) and it makes sense that they would enrich thegame with information from sources and ideas that only they can access. So I would certainly use Hylian language in a timeline. It is in the game.

And the stranger occurances, the ones that seem like Easter Eggs at first, they might also be significant. I think it's important that the sword of Phanton Ganon in tWW is made by the two smithies in MM. It probably isn't a HUGE timeline deal, more like a little comment about the exact nature of MM and its exsistence along side Hyrule.
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Old 07-15-2006, 10:36 AM
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

I think that writing on Phantom Ganon's sword is an easter egg. I'm probably wrong, but it might be an easter egg for fans of Zelda. If PG's sword was made by Zabora and Gabora, then it opens up the whole "is Termina in a different dimension to Hyrule?" debate, so I think it's a small easter egg.
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Old 07-15-2006, 11:28 AM
vacumgod United_States vacumgod is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

The exsistence text itself matters more, the fact that MHS appears in TMC as apposed to OoT's AHS definantly means that TMC is after OoT, which is really the way it should be.
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Old 07-15-2006, 12:17 PM
Chad Chad is a male United States Chad is online now
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

All this talk of Hylian language has piqued my interest. MoALttP, where did you get the source for these translations, and why do you say transliterate? Maybe this is crossing the border into Zelda series fanboyism, but it might be cool to be able to read Hylian.

I'd like to get into this, and I might read further into your threads petaining to Hylian script than I previously did.
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Old 07-15-2006, 08:12 PM
Master of ALttP United_States Master of ALttP is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daphnes
All this talk of Hylian language has piqued my interest. MoALttP, where did you get the source for these translations, and why do you say transliterate? Maybe this is crossing the border into Zelda series fanboyism, but it might be cool to be able to read Hylian.
It's not fanboyism when you and some friends can write in Hylian. I can't, and nobody I know can. I hope to someday, but that'll be purely for the sake of being a hardcore Zelda fan. Transliterate is the term used when you take one language that you don't understand and change it to another language that you don't understand so that you can perhaps translate it. I think that's what it means, go look it up if you want the actual definition.

Quote:
I'd like to get into this, and I might read further into your threads petaining to Hylian script than I previously did.
You really should. When Twilight Princess comes out, I'll be translating every last bit of text. I may even start up my own website to post my findings on. Twilight Princess is supposed to have a new form of Hylian, and that'll be the one that I'll learn. I already know a few symbols of both Hairugo and Hairiamoji, but the one that I'll actually use will be TP's Hylian. I'll need to become fluent in Japanese first, however... But I'm sure that'll also be enjoyable!
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Old 07-16-2006, 04:35 AM
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

There are several supposed Hylian to English translations of Hylian, and I can read and write those, but since it's not the proper form of Hylian, I guess it doesn't count.
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Old 07-16-2006, 12:51 PM
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

Quote:
Originally Posted by Master of ALttP
I'm mostly talking about the text itself, not what it says. My biggest deal with it is that people on the GameFAQs boards don't give a Rupee about me finding Hairiamoji in The Minish Cap. They still place it before Ocarina of Time, which must have been done when they were both high and drunk. Anyways, I like the responses that I've gotten so far. I hope I can get some more.

Now,i think that you have forgotten that some gamefaqs users are here on zu..
Last I checked,i complimented your find.Can't remember?I can produce a link if you'd like.
also,there are some there who do favor TMC coming after OOT,but they haven't found too much of an urge to make a timeline with it as such.

Also,many believe the hylian you discovered in TMC to be an easter egg,as it is small scale.It is not widespread..
Ans as i pointed out previously,the developers may have used that style out of convenience,and at that point of the game,seriously,few will stop to notice the writing,and if they do,many won't even care what it means,Or the style for that matter...

Like I said,it was a good find....
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Old 07-16-2006, 01:46 PM
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

MoALttP, are you using a website or a friend to translate the text? Or are you translating it all by yourself? If you get really stuck I might be able to help since I know this japanese guy who could probably do some translations.
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Old 07-16-2006, 01:56 PM
Master of ALttP United_States Master of ALttP is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Meat
MoALttP, are you using a website or a friend to translate the text? Or are you translating it all by yourself? If you get really stuck I might be able to help since I know this japanese guy who could probably do some translations.
That would be really nice if you could do that. I don't know of any sites, and the person that I can have translate for me isn't online very often. (Well, at least not when I am.) If you could get them to translate for me, then that'd be really great.

Quote:
Originally Posted by onilunk
Now,i think that you have forgotten that some gamefaqs users are here on zu..
I didn't forget. I was just under the assumption that they still hadn't been able to get on. Congratulations for getting on, but I see you mistyped your name. You could probably ask around to see where you could get it changed to "onilink" or however you want it spelled.

Quote:
Last I checked,i complimented your find.Can't remember?I can produce a link if you'd like.
That won't be necessary. I may have skipped the page, or completely forgotten about it with all the stupid comments from people such as Impossible II and TripleEspresso9.

Quote:
also,there are some there who do favor TMC coming after OOT,but they haven't found too much of an urge to make a timeline with it as such.
Which is what I did. I gave a reason as to why it must come afterwards and for current timeline theories to be adjusted. People at GameFAQs see everything about the Hylian I found to be an Easter egg.

Quote:
Also,many believe the hylian you discovered in TMC to be an easter egg,as it is small scale.It is not widespread..
If it's not widespread then why is it that the public library has seventeen occurances of Modern Hylian? Why is it that I found Modern Hylian in Rem's Shoe Shop? If that's not widespread, then I don't know what is.

Quote:
Ans as i pointed out previously,the developers may have used that style out of convenience,and at that point of the game,seriously,few will stop to notice the writing,and if they do,many won't even care what it means,Or the style for that matter...
They may have, but it doesn't matter. If it's in the game, then it's in the game. If you look at the games as a historical account, then if you see Modern Hylian in the public library, guess what? The people use Modern Hylian. I know that it's a whole lot easier to use than Old Hylian and that it looks much better, but it doesn't matter for what reason the language was used in the game. If the language is used at all, then it's the language that they use.

Quote:
Like I said,it was a good find....
Thank you very much, but people aren't giving it the recognition it deserves. They're just saying, "Oh, that's interesting." and then they're shoving it aside.
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Old 07-16-2006, 02:04 PM
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

Ok, but he's in switzerland right now. I'm not sure when he's coming back but when he does we can get cracking.
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Old 07-16-2006, 02:07 PM
Master of ALttP United_States Master of ALttP is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

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Originally Posted by Uncle Meat
Ok, but he's in switzerland right now. I'm not sure when he's coming back but when he does we can get cracking.
If that's the case, then I'll just try finding another translator. I thank you for the effort, but this stuff needs translated as soon as possible. Perhaps he could assist us with Twilight Princess translations?
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Old 07-16-2006, 02:08 PM
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

I think for the most part, the creation of Old Hylian/Modern Hylian is to further emphasise the decline in the Hylian race, just as the pointy ears were brought up in TWW. The only reason to actually study the translations is because theorists like ourselves enjoy analysing every word in every sentence, even when it doesn't really make a difference to the timeline.
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Old 07-16-2006, 02:17 PM
Master of ALttP United_States Master of ALttP is offline
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhurvid
I think for the most part, the creation of Old Hylian/Modern Hylian is to further emphasise the decline in the Hylian race, just as the pointy ears were brought up in TWW. The only reason to actually study the translations is because theorists like ourselves enjoy analysing every word in every sentence, even when it doesn't really make a difference to the timeline.
The translated text very rarely makes a difference in the timeline, if there's ever been an example of it changing the popular opinion of any group of theorists. My focus is the text itself right now. Since we see Modern Hylian text in TMC, then the text is canon. I don't care why it's in there or why it isn't another form of Hylian. That is outside of the game, and that doesn't matter. The fact is, Modern Hylian script is used in TMC, and anything in a Zelda game is considered to be canon.
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Old 07-16-2006, 02:19 PM
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

Quote:
Originally Posted by Master of ALttP
If that's the case, then I'll just try finding another translator. I thank you for the effort, but this stuff needs translated as soon as possible. Perhaps he could assist us with Twilight Princess translations?
Yeah I'm sure he can help unless he's gone back to Japan by then. I haven't spoken to him in a while since he's been travelling so much so I can't remember when he's leaving europe. I'll ask him when he gets back.
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Old 07-16-2006, 02:42 PM
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Re: The importance of Hairiamoji

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Originally Posted by Uncle Meat
Yeah I'm sure he can help unless he's gone back to Japan by then. I haven't spoken to him in a while since he's been travelling so much so I can't remember when he's leaving europe. I'll ask him when he gets back.
Okay. You do that. If he does go back to Japan, just see if he could give you an email address, or something. That way you'll be able to keep in touch with him.
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