TP-FSA connection, Zelda Informer theory

Originally Posted by The Baton of the Wind

FSA doesn't give any details about its connection to FS

I wouldn't say that's entirely true. In the very beginning of FSA, it retells what happened during the events of FS. It sums up how Vaati escaped the Four Sword, kidnapped Zelda, and was ultimately resealed in the Four Sword by Link.

FSA then tells us that "And, for a time, the people of Hyrule believed that their land was safe. Until..." and then the game starts. So the quote is essentially saying that the people of Hyrule believed they were safe from the time FS concluded until the time that FSA began. So that bit of information is very anti-splitting up FS/FSA.

Granted, we can play the "the Twilight Realm hid the dangers of Zant and Ganondorf from the people of Hyrule, so they didn't realize Hyrule was in danger during those events" card to explain away TP, but that still doesn't account for OoT/Ganon invading and trying to take over Hyrule as the renowned evil magic-wielder, demon prince during TP's back story... Those events clearly weren't hidden from the people of Hyrule, and therefore don't fit FSA's back story about Hyrule believing it was safe between the events of FS and FSA.

I'm almost positive that in Wind Waker when you get the shield the text says that this sheild was used the hero of time or something like that.
"You got the Hero's Shield! This is the legendary shield said to have been used by the hero himself!"

^Right. And since the only hero spoken of in the game up to this point is the Hero of Time, it's clearly meant to be a reference to the Hero of Time despite it not specifying his title.

However, because this shield is merely "said to have been used" by the Hero of Time, that could mean that it was actually used by some other hero instead and merely attributed to the Hero of Time by mistake. (Not that that's necessarily a likely possibility, but it is a possibility, nonetheless.)

Doesn't say hero of time. It just says "the hero of legend." The Four Sword heroes were heroes of legend, as well. Plus, again, it looks exactly like:

It says that but Grannie says that the shield is the family shield. Like we surely know Link did not had children in the AT. The only candidate would be four sword saga Link

Well, considering the opening sequence of WW is of the HoT and then when you get the shield it says "the hero" used it I think we can assume it was talking about the Hero of Time

And since MC and FS, including its backstory, all take place some time before Wind Waker, I doubt the only legend throughout the great sea, was that of the hero of time. Though the most prominent, I'd venture to say not the only one.

Originally Posted by tlozbj

But that is disproven when Grannie says that the shield is the family shield. Because Oot Link had no children in the adult timeline.

I'm geussing it wasn't used by any hero and that was just a legend about it. Anyway, the whole point of me bringing that up is that looks cant be used as evidence.

---------- Post added at 04:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:33 PM ----------

The only reason FSA shield looks like that is it was based off of Wind Wakers design of Link.

Originally Posted by Volvagia_slayer

I wouldn't say that's entirely true. In the very beginning of FSA, it retells what happened during the events of FS. It sums up how Vaati escaped the Four Sword, kidnapped Zelda, and was ultimately resealed in the Four Sword by Link.

FSA then tells us that "And, for a time, the people of Hyrule believed that their land was safe. Until..." and then the game starts. So the quote is essentially saying that the people of Hyrule believed they were safe from the time FS concluded until the time that FSA began. So that bit of information is very anti-splitting up FS/FSA.

Granted, we can play the "the Twilight Realm hid the dangers of Zant and Ganondorf from the people of Hyrule, so they didn't realize Hyrule was in danger during those events" card to explain away TP, but that still doesn't account for OoT/Ganon invading and trying to take over Hyrule as the renowned evil magic-wielder, demon prince during TP's back story... Those events clearly weren't hidden from the people of Hyrule, and therefore don't fit FSA's back story about Hyrule believing it was safe between the events of FS and FSA.

Actually, in the child era Ganondorf didn't do anything. Link told Zelda about the future events and the rest is history.

Originally Posted by The Baton of the Wind

Actually, in the child era Ganondorf didn't do anything. Link told Zelda about the future events and the rest is history.

TP specifically tells us that Ganondorf invaded Hyrule before his capture.

Originally Posted by The Baton of the Wind

As for the TP > FSA: It is true that though it makes sense that FS > FSA, FSA doesn't give any details about its connection to FS nor does it say how much time has passed between the events it speaks of and the initial story.

What do you mean? The fact that Zelda and Link are specified by name in the prologue when talking about Vaati's escape and subsequent re-imprisonment indicates that it's the same pair, since Heroes are never mentioned by name after their own eras. Unless you mean between the prelude to FSA and the events of the FS legend itself, in which case I agree with you that we don't know how much time passed between the events of the FS legend and FSA, so the prelude to FSA might actually not be FS itself. Despite my own feelings on how that affects the narrative.

Perhaps the prologue to FSA it wasn't a reference to FS at all? Maybe FSA Link and Zelda had participated in a separate resealing of Vaati shortly before the events of FSA?

Didn't FSA Link have to proof he was a hero or something? I believe Kaepora Gaebora said something like that in the game.

Originally Posted by Nagumo

Didn't FSA Link have to proof he was a hero or something? I believe Kaepora Gaebora said something like that in the game.

Sort of. KG said that by drawing forth the Four Sword, Link had accepted the destiny of the hero. This seems to indicate that before FSA, Link had not accepted the destiny of the hero, despite the fact that FS Link had drawn forth the Four Sword in his own game (thereby making it so that the two Links can't be the same person).

FSA's method of telling its back story would certainly make more sense if FS Link and FSA Link were the same guy, but that bit of in-game evidence suggests they aren't the same person. On top of that, FSA's box says that it takes place years after the events of FS, but Link and Zelda look the same age, further suggesting they can't be the same people. (And further more, FSA Zelda dresses differently and wears her hair differently from FS Zelda; we've never seen Zelda change her appearance in any other Zelda sequels where she was supposed to be the same in both games.)

Originally Posted by AStinkToThePast

Perhaps the prologue to FSA it wasn't a reference to FS at all? Maybe FSA Link and Zelda had participated in a separate resealing of Vaati shortly before the events of FSA?

Well, that's pretty much the running handwave to reconcile FSA with the Historia.

Originally Posted by Volvagia_slayer

Sort of. KG said that by drawing forth the Four Sword, Link had accepted the destiny of the hero. This seems to indicate that before FSA, Link had not accepted the destiny of the hero, despite the fact that FS Link had drawn forth the Four Sword in his own game (thereby making it so that the two Links can't be the same person).

Vaati was released when the Four Sword was drawn at the beginning of FSA, though. That means that he was sealed by the sword when he was beaten by FSA Link. Which generally necessitates him drawing it for use in battle.

FSA's method of telling its back story would certainly make more sense if FS Link and FSA Link were the same guy, but that bit of in-game evidence suggests they aren't the same person. On top of that, FSA's box says that it takes place years after the events of FS, but Link and Zelda look the same age, further suggesting they can't be the same people. (And further more, FSA Zelda dresses differently and wears her hair differently from FS Zelda; we've never seen Zelda change her appearance in any other Zelda sequels where she was supposed to be the same in both games.)

The version of the box I'm looking at never mentions FS the game.

Originally Posted by FS box (NoA ver)

One Destiny, Four Links!

For years, the mighty Four Sword sealed away an evil force...until one day, a dark shadow tricked young Link into drawing the sword from its resting place. Now, divided the sword's curse, the four Links must unite to free Hyrule from darkness!

Unite the four Links and master their battle formations to fight off fiendish hordes, or command them individually and unravel the secrets of Hyrule's lands.

Using four Game Boy Advance system, explore the land with up to three friends. Work together, but remember, only one of you can be the true Hero of Light! Fight off countless enemies, but don't let your friends grab all the treasure, or you'll be left in the dark!

The prologue seems to indicate that the "years" bit is actually in reference to the events of the original legend, and not the last time Vaati escaped.

Originally Posted by Anima†eur

Wolf Link is a manifestation of Link's dark emotions.

What the?

No its not. He 's just the form the Hero takes when he enters the Twilight. It has nothing to do with Link's "emotions"

Originally Posted by Darth Yoshi

Vaati was released when the Four Sword was drawn at the beginning of FSA, though. That means that he was sealed by the sword when he was beaten by FSA Link. Which generally necessitates him drawing it for use in battle.

I don't follow. What does that have to do with the bit of my post you quoted? (Plus, Vaati isn't sealed in the sword when FSA Link beats him. He "dies" but seems to do that "going to the Dark World" animation in the process.)

Originally Posted by Darth Yoshi

The version of the box I'm looking at never mentions FS the game.

It mentions that Vaati was sealed in the Four Sword until the events of FSA. So unless the events of FS no longer happened, it's referring to FS.

Originally Posted by Darth Yoshi

The prologue seems to indicate that the "years" bit is actually in reference to the events of the original legend, and not the last time Vaati escaped.

No, because the prologue says that "Ages passed" between the original legend and FS. It only uses the word "years" when referring to the relationship between FS and FSA.

Originally Posted by Volvagia_slayer

I don't follow. What does that have to do with the bit of my post you quoted? (Plus, Vaati isn't sealed in the sword when FSA Link beats him. He "dies" but seems to do that "going to the Dark World" animation in the process.)

The FSA prologue says that Vaati escaped between the original events of the legend and the start of FSA. It also specifically names the one who beat Vaati when he escaped as Link, Zelda's friend. No Hero is ever referred to by name after their own eras, which means the Link who beat Vaati is the same Link in FSA. as having been involved in sealing Vaati before the start of FSA. Since Vaati is imprisoned by the sword when FSA begins, that means that when Link beat Vaati before FSA, he drew the Four Sword to do it.

It mentions that Vaati was sealed in the Four Sword until the events of FSA. So unless the events of FS no longer happened, it's referring to FS.

No, because the prologue says that "Ages passed" between the original legend and FS. It only uses the word "years" when referring to the relationship between FS and FSA.

Assuming that is the case, the fact that there are no numerical qualifiers means that the amount of time between FS and FSA could be as little as 2 years. Certainly the scope of the current generation is plausible, because the prologue specifically says that Vaati did escape once before during that time.

Even if the amount of time were, say, 10 years rather than 2, it still wouldn't be a problem, since in ST the window depicting Queen Tetra looks identical to her appearance in WW and PH, despite presumably having been commissioned years later and being modeled on her adult appearance.

Oh, I just remembered something.

Originally Posted by Volvagia_slayer

(And further more, FSA Zelda dresses differently and wears her hair differently from FS Zelda; we've never seen Zelda change her appearance in any other Zelda sequels where she was supposed to be the same in both games.)

This is not true. Going by the Historia, the same Hero is apparently in both LttP and OoS. As such, the games should have the same Zelda as well, and her appearance changes from LttP to OoS.

It is just the usual stubborn attitude and refusal to except anything they do not like on fandom's part. If they don't like it, it is not canon.

Four Swords Adventures is mostly a standalone story, leaving it open to several different placements in the Zelda timeline; however, it has subtle things that prevent it from going just anywhere: Ganon already exists, ruling out the pre-split/unified timeline; it is set in the usual state of Old Hyrule, ruling out the Adult Timeline; while it may have once had ties to A Link to the Past, Miyamoto disconnected them, revealing developer intention and removing it from the Decline Timeline; Twilight Princess was originally set to have Ganondorf revealing that he would be reborn one day, which is what happens in Four Swords Adventures, and both games are tied to what seems to be the same backstory, and the people of the desert have recently allied with Hyrule after the separation of the lands as seen in Twilight Princess.

Originally Posted by Darth Yoshi

No Hero is ever referred to by name after their own eras, which means the Link who beat Vaati is the same Link in FSA.

Even though that would make sense, the rest of the evidence doesn't back up that idea. So we just have to assume that this is an exception to the rule that would normally make sense, or else we have to assume that both KG and the FSA prologue and packing material is mistaken. The former option is the simpler of the two that fits all the data.

Originally Posted by Darth Yoshi

This is not true. Going by the Historia, the same Hero is apparently in both LttP and OoS. As such, the games should have the same Zelda as well, and her appearance changes from LttP to OoS.

How can it be the same Zelda when she introduces herself to Link in the Oracles game? Besides, I was specifically talking about games which are confirmed to be sequels in-game. Like MM to OoT, AoL to LoZ, PH to TWW, etc.

Originally Posted by Her Grace

It is just the usual stubborn attitude and refusal to except anything they do not like on fandom's part. If they don't like it, it is not canon.

You might want to read the thread next time... No one is saying FSA's HH placement is non-canon. The article in question is asking where a better place for FSA might be, and because there are better places for FS/FSA than where HH has it, that's why this discussion exists. It has nothing to do with how canon something is or isn't.