Melee vs Brawl

Overall, which is better? I don't want to hear x is better because it has x character or because of better graphics in comparison or because of anything like that. I mean on a level of gameplay, graphics FOR THEIR TIME and also, just which you overall enjoyed the most. To me, Brawl is a great game, but it lacks the "magic" that Melee had...something about Melee just felt more....awesome.

Brawl's better because it had a better story line and the characters.

Brawl>Melee>Smash 64
Brawl had more stages, items and characters over the rest, and I overall had the most fun with it. I still play the others sometimes with friends.

Pokemanz<Universe

Melee is superior.

It didn't have moon gravity, absurd items, overpowered characters, and an over-abundance of gimmicks and hazards in stages. You couldn't just hop off the stage carelessly, knowing you'll get back everytime. Nobody could air dodge constantly. The AI actually fought amongst themselves. Captain Falcon wasn't abysmal. Opponents could be KO'd with less than 100% damage. Pokeballs weren't worthless. Each series had relatively equal representation in terms of stages, trophies and characters. The Adventure Mode could be cleared in less than a day. You got rewards for doing said Adventure Mode on harder difficulties. It actually had you go through Nintendo locales instead of the generic "Plains", "Cave", "Ruins". Each character had their own Target Test. The events didn't suck. There were more events. There were very few BAD Nintendo games when it was made, so mostly content from good games was put in.

Anything I missed?

Originally Posted by Quin

Brawl>Melee>Smash 64
Brawl had more stages, items and characters over the rest, and I overall had the most fun with it. I still play the others sometimes with friends.

I usually only go back to Melee if I want to do the combo I can do with Falco that I can't do in Brawl.

Originally Posted by Metal_Sonic

Melee is superior.

It didn't have moon gravity, absurd items, overpowered characters, and an over-abundance of gimmicks and hazards in stages. You couldn't just hop off the stage carelessly, knowing you'll get back everytime. Nobody could air dodge constantly. The AI actually fought amongst themselves. Captain Falcon wasn't abysmal. Opponents could be KO'd with less than 100% damage. Pokeballs weren't worthless. Each series had relatively equal representation in terms of stages, trophies and characters. The Adventure Mode could be cleared in less than a day. You got rewards for doing said Adventure Mode on harder difficulties. It actually had you go through Nintendo locales instead of the generic "Plains", "Cave", "Ruins". Each character had their own Target Test. The events didn't suck. There were more events. There were very few BAD Nintendo games when it was made, so mostly content from good games was put in.

Anything I missed?

Absurd items? Do I have to remind you of one of the most powerful items in Melee that wasn't in Brawl (the red shell).

Brawl is WAY better. I actually think Melee sucks compared to Brawl (but I don't think Melee is a sucky game overall, no way). Brawl just improved on it way too much. XD

The stage builder and SSE are the only things I think could have been even better than they were aside from the balance in the character roster, which was really not too much better than in Melee (perfectly scored Meta Knight anyone?).

But Brawl has much better stages, items that are more fun, lots of fun new modes like the Boss Battles, Masterpieces, Challenges, and more.

Completely lagless online would've been nice though. Still, having online is better than not having it at all.

Originally Posted by FD-Oni Link

I usually only go back to Melee if I want to do the combo I can do with Falco that I can't do in Brawl.

Absurd items? Do I have to remind you of one of the most powerful items in Melee that wasn't in Brawl (the red shell).

Yes, but the Red Shell at least forced the user to dodge.

Smash Balls, the Dragoon, and the Cracker Launcher essentially give you a free KO. While Lightning, Timers, and Assist Trophies backfire rather frequently.

Brawl was so good that I completely forgot about Melee.

Explosive items, especially Smart Bombs, backfire often too. xP

Not to mention the Bumpers, Green Shells, Poison Mushrooms, and other stuff can harm the user as well.

Originally Posted by Metal_Sonic

Yes, but the Red Shell at least posed a threat to the user.

Smash Balls, the Dragoon, and the Cracker Launcher essentially give you a free KO. While Lightning, Timers, and Assist Trophies backfire rather frequently.

Yeah, but with an 80% hit every time. I think the red shell is really powerful. That's basically an automatic KO if you get hit by someone.

Smash Ball can backfire if you don't use it right.
Dragoon can backfire if you miss your target.
Cracker Launcher can backfire if someone like Fox with a reflector that can make it go back.
Assist trophies can never backfire. It may make it where you can't see or anything, but it messes up the other person, too.

edit: We can all agree that the red shell is easily one of the most powerful items in Melee.

Overall I'd probably give it to Brawl. The series definitely has improved with the times, however I wouldn't place Brawl all too high above melee. It didn't really give much more than was expected. More/different items/characters/stages/music.

Originally Posted by Lady Ranny

Explosive items, especially Smart Bombs, backfire often too. xP

Not to mention the Bumpers, Green Shells, Poison Mushrooms, and other stuff can harm the user as well.

Only if you get caught in them- Oh wait. Brawl made it so Smart Bombs work erratically. I could throw one at Bowser and have it bounce off. He could pick it up and throw it back before it went off.

Bumpers remain in a fixed spot, Green Shells always bounce back, and at least you can tell if a mushroom is Poison or Super.

Originally Posted by FD-Oni Link

Yeah, but with an 80% hit every time. I think the red shell is really powerful. That's basically an automatic KO if you get hit by someone.

Smash Ball can backfire if you don't use it right.
Dragoon can backfire if you miss your target.
Cracker Launcher can backfire if someone like Fox with a reflector that can make it go back.
Assist trophies can never backfire. It may make it where you can't see or anything, but it messes up the other person, too.

But they also pose a threat to the user once thrown.

Only if you don't use it at the right time.
Not really. Nothing negative happens.
That goes for any projectile.
Tingle can drop hammers, and CPUs are unaffected by everything that makes it hard to see.

Nothing says an opponent can't just throw you into a Bumper that's already in a fixed spot. It really depends on where it's sitting.

EDIT: Oh also, some characters KO themselves with their FSs. Namely Marth, the Star Fox Trio, Luigi if he happens to use it where there's no solid ground below him, Ike if he's on a stage like Mushroomy Kingdom Underground and he happens to be over one of the pitfalls, and Wario if the player accidentally suicides as Wario Man. xP

And nothing says they can't be thrown into them.

Originally Posted by Metal_Sonic

Only if you get caught in them- Oh wait. Brawl made it so Smart Bombs work erratically. I could throw one at Bowser and have it bounce off. He could pick it up and throw it back before it went off.

Bumpers remain in a fixed spot, Green Shells always bounce back, and at least you can tell if a mushroom is Poison or Super.

But they also pose a threat to the user once thrown.

Only if you don't use it at the right time.
Not really. Nothing negative happens.
That goes for any projectile.
Tingle can drop hammers, and CPUs are unaffected by everything that makes it hard to see.

I never said it wouldn't pose a threat to the user, I said with it hurting you 80% every time it really hurts everyone.

That's what I mean by it backfiring.
It still backfires because you don't get the person.
Yeah I know, but I was using your example and you agree I'm right about it.
That doesn't mean it's a backfire, you get the hammer first, then you get the person and they'll never get a chance to get you.

Dragoon has no backfire even when missed, since your coming down with invincibility so nothing bad actually happens to you.

Originally Posted by Quin

Dragoon has no backfire even when missed, since your coming down with invincibility so nothing bad actually happens to you.

That means the smash ball has no backfire either then. You may think there is, but I was talking about the ones you have to activate by hitting someone.

Nope, unless you activate it on dumb moments, like the zero lazer in the air with no ground underneath you. You almost always die in your transformation.

Originally Posted by FD-Oni Link

I never said it wouldn't pose a threat to the user, I said with it hurting you 80% every time it really hurts everyone.

That's what I mean by it backfiring.
It still backfires because you don't get the person.
Yeah I know, but I was using your example and you agree I'm right about it.
That doesn't mean it's a backfire, you get the hammer first, then you get the person and they'll never get a chance to get you.

Good. Then it's an actual item and not just a hazard.

What Quin said.
...What Quin said.
Okay then. If I fire a shot from a Ray Gun and it gets reflected, I guess it backfired due to luck.
Unless they get a hammer first or yours is a dud.