Japanese Brawl Tier List

I'm going to choose to take that as a compliment, and move on.

G'night Smashers.

Originally posted by Tigerboi
That isn't THE key to learning Ike. Ikes main tools are his reach an priority. Its really all he has.

Hey now, give his strength some credit. The guy can throw opponets around like they're ragdolls.

Originally Posted by Kitsuné

I'm going to choose to take that as a compliment, and move on.

G'night Smashers.

It was meant to be. Again, time zones are stupid.

Originally Posted by Jeff

Hey now, give his strength some credit. The guy can throw opponets around like they're ragdolls.

All that strength means nothing if he can't land a hit.

Originally Posted by Jeff

Hey now, give his strength some credit. The guy can throw opponets around like they're ragdolls.

For the record, I play Ike.

I don't think he's ever going to SUCK in the metagame.

bair, up smash, forward smash, dair, side b and up b, N-a are all really good moves.

He has godly priority. (N-a stops a falcon punch)

His recovery is damn near impossible to gimp.

He's not a bad character.

But his main game is offense. And there are characters that are just alot better at it than he is. There's not much bad about ike. there's just alot about ike that other characters do better.

Oh, and Falco Kills him.

Ike has many shield poking attacks, and a counter. He can land hits.
^Falco kills a lot of characters, lol.

Originally posted by Lord Golbez
All that strength means nothing if he can't land a hit.

And if you're good enough, you can land plenty of hits. Really, all you need is a couple with him to knock someone off. Get close to the edge and hit your opponent with his Fordward Smash or Side-B; they're gone.

Originally posted by Tigerboi
But his main game is offense. And there are characters that are just alot better at it than he is. There's not much bad about ike. there's just alot about ike that other characters do better.

See, I find Ike to be a great defensive character. Bull-rushing with him is just stupid, but constantly keeping a gap between you and your foe while waiting to catch him off guard has always worked the best for me. I mean, with his reach, he can hit with just about anything, while your opponent has to try and close in on you. Not to mention he can be good for edge-guarding.

If Ike camps to much , he gets shot at in a lot of matches.

There are certain opponents (snake) that just force him in close. But he can rush pretty well if you you know what you're doing.

His fair and bair make rushing with him extremely possible. f-tilt is good for when you're close.

Seriously,offense is his best game.

I don't mind getting hit with a few projectiles since he can take so much damage. Obviously if the opponent is spamming, going in close is your only choice. I haven't played too many people that do it that much, though, so what I've been used to is keeping that sword-length distance between me and the other guy and hitting him with the reach attacks.

However, as that vid showed, if you can manage some combos, by all means going on the offensive is the best choice of action. He's great for juggling, and he punishes the hell out of guys on stages with platforms. You just have to pick your spots very carefully with him, otherwise his lag brings you down.

Campers are Ikes worst enemy. He has to rush them down before they rack up damage on him from a distance.

Btw, have you learned to tolerate campers yet?

Yeah. I don't know if you were around at the time, but I eventually admitted that I was *****ing over nothing during that argument with you and Buzz, and that I had the wrong attitude about camping.

I won't mention their name, but a couple weeks ago I had easily a dozen or more matches with a member here that often employed a camp/spam projectile strategy. He beat me up for a few matches, then I found some avenues around it and ended up winning a lot of the fights.

Originally Posted by Tigerboi

For the record, I play Ike.

I don't think he's ever going to SUCK in the metagame.

bair, up smash, forward smash, dair, side b and up b, N-a are all really good moves.

He has godly priority. (N-a stops a falcon punch)

His recovery is damn near impossible to gimp.

He's not a bad character.

But his main game is offense. And there are characters that are just alot better at it than he is. There's not much bad about ike. there's just alot about ike that other characters do better.

Oh, and Falco Kills him.

Agreed.

Except for the Falco bit. I've beaten at least a couple good Falcos with my Ike before. Ike can defeat anyone when he's in the right hands. It's just not easy to be skilled enough. Against characters like Meta Knight or Snake, obviously I'm tossed around like a ragdoll. I need to get better in order to take them down.

...Actually, I did beat a Meta Knight once, but that person wasn't good with him, so yeah.

Originally Posted by Lord Ranil

Agreed.

Except for the Falco bit. I've beaten at least a couple good Falcos with my Ike before. Ike can defeat anyone when he's in the right hands. It's just not easy to be skilled enough. Against characters like Meta Knight or Snake, obviously I'm tossed around like a ragdoll. I need to get better in order to take them down.

...Actually, I did beat a Meta Knight once, but that person wasn't good with him, so yeah.

Falco murders him with his chaingrab, SHDL, and his fast spike. Those two Falcos probably weren't that good.

Originally Posted by Lord Golbez

Falco murders him with his chaingrab, SHDL, and his fast spike. Those two Falcos probably weren't that good.

Unless Ike can easily get out of it, which I've learned to do. I've defeated IGNIS, Verxis, and Toon Flink's Falcos. IGNIS and Verxis are just overall very good players, Toon Flink chaingrabs a lot. Hell, he chainspikes and I've gotten out of it.

Given it took me a little time to learn, but I did. Ike is a danger to Falco if he can get out of the chaingrab and spiking.

waitwaitwait
Ike's recovery is either godly or total **** depending on how you look at it. When even Ganondorf can kill him at 20% if he goes too far to the side...

Ike's recovery is pretty good, the way I see it. Not the best, but it's pretty good. The only problem is that he lacks diagonal recovery. Meaning, if he's knocked far from the stage but not high up, he's screwed. Few characters can get out of that anyway.

I'd say the only ones are Snake, Meta Knight, Luigi, and maybe Peach. Snake and Meta Knight are obvious, Luigi is one of the few characters who can do up B after side B (however the others, such as Mario, can't go nearly as far with side B, so they cannot recover in this case), and Peach might be able to get out via her parasol.

This is one reason why I say Luigi can be high tier.

Originally Posted by Lord Ranil

Ike's recovery is pretty good, the way I see it. Not the best, but it's pretty good. The only problem is that he lacks diagonal recovery. Meaning, if he's knocked far from the stage but not high up, he's screwed. Few characters can get out of that anyway.

I'd say the only ones are Snake, Meta Knight, Luigi, and maybe Peach. Snake and Meta Knight are obvious, Luigi is one of the few characters who can do up B after side B (however the others, such as Mario, can't go nearly as far with side B, so they cannot recover in this case), and Peach might be able to get out via her parasol.

This is one reason why I say Luigi can be high tier.

I'm very cynical. If you play against an opponent with brains, he will block your quick draw in the air. That, and his diagonal recovery (G&W dsmash LOL) where the "****" part comes to play. See what I mean? ;>

Originally Posted by Linkey

I'm very cynical. If you play against an opponent with brains, he will block your quick draw in the air. That, and his diagonal recovery (G&W dsmash LOL) where the "****" part comes to play. See what I mean? ;>

Meh, it's quite hard to land a dsmash(horizontal) on Ike.
You would think about the dthrow, but Ike is too heavy and can tech that.

^Yes, this and I learned a technique from a certain Marth player to get out of that and it involves Counter. However, it'll only work if Ike hasn't used his second jump. He'll need the extra boost in height.

I call it Counter Recovery. First, if your opponent thinks you're going to use Quick Draw, and jumps off the stage in an attempt to stop the move, don't use it. Jump, then use Counter on the opponent's attack and then you're free to recover with Quick Draw. Or if, you're below the stage, but close enough, use Aether.

You can't do this without a second jump, though, like I said, because Ike more than likely won't get high up enough without it.

Lucario vs Ike = Grabs, dair, dair, dair, Extreme Speed, watch Ike Aether to his death. Repeat until you've won. Throw in Aura Spheres also for comic effect.

The thing about Ike's Aether recovery is just how (for want of a better word) linear it is. :<