Regarding the Capitalization of random Words pertaining to God, gods & Religion.

I will admit that I used to be one of those people who decapitalized the name of the Christian god intentionally, but after thinking about it I realized how silly this was. God is his name, and whether he exists or not is irrelevant regarding this.

But there is still something which bugs me.

The most common problem I see is the capitalization of the words "he", "him", and "word". These are not proper nouns (unlike names); they are two pronouns and a common noun.

Other words I've seen incorrectly capitalized are "gods", "deity", and "holy"*... And that's just within the past ten minutes.

Could someone please tell me why otherwise quite literate Christians** must butcher the English language so badly?




*Note that saying "The Holy Bible" is correct, due to being part of a proper noun, but "no-one is more Holy than God" is not, as that context makes it an adjective.

**"Christian" is a proper noun just like "American" or "European"

It's incorrect to capitalize those pronouns if they are not placed in the beginning of a sentence. Why contemplate further? The capitalization of "He" when referring to God is probably a result of custom or a way to differ God from an ordinary man. These punctuation errors are hardly a case of butchering the English language.

"word" is often synonymous with "the holy ghost" which is part of the trinity which is God.
"He" when is reflective of the Christian god (see what I did there....) is just a place holder for "God" and is capitalized so as not to confuse with "he" meaning...John the Baptist, for example.

again with "him": when it is reflecting the god of Abraham should be capitalized as God is capitalized.

To make things more confusing: if I where Jewish every letter "o" in the word "God" would be replaces with an "*".

/not-sober

The word "god" is a common noun, a verb or an interjection, depending on how it's used.

Yahweh and Jehovah are proper nouns, however English translations of the bible rarely, if ever, use these names, instead the bible mistakenly uses the words "god" and "lord" as proper nouns.

So you can blame John Wycliffe, Thomas Cranmer and all the other people throughout history that have translated the bible for butchering the English language.

English was doomed when they dropped Germanic cases and conjugations.
The Biblical translators where just speeding up the process at that point.

Originally Posted by Swizzzle

...instead the bible mistakenly uses the words "god" and "lord" as proper nouns.

God
Lord

Also, you forgot to capitalize the word Bible in your post

Originally Posted by IGNIS

It's incorrect to capitalize those pronouns if they are not placed in the beginning of a sentence. Why contemplate further? The capitalization of "He" when referring to God is probably a result of custom or a way to differ God from an ordinary man. These punctuation errors are hardly a high degree of "butcher the English language so badly."

But does a custom like that even have any use? And if God gave humanity language, then you'd think it would at least be consistent.

(Oh, and I was slightly exaggerating. No other reason I'd use the word "butcher", really. :/)

Originally Posted by Erasmus

"word" is often synonymous with "the holy ghost" which is part of the trinity which is God.
"He" when is reflective of the Christian god (see what I did there....) is just a place holder for "God" and is capitalized so as not to confuse with "he" meaning...John the Baptist, for example.

again with "him": when it is reflecting the god of Abraham should be capitalized as God is capitalized.

To make things more confusing: if I where Jewish every letter "o" in the word "God" would be replaces with an "*".

/not-sober

Still doesn't mean it should be capitalized.

Irrelevant.

I don't see why.

I have seen that, and I don't like that either. But at least I don't see it anywhere near as much.

Originally Posted by Swizzzle

The word "god" is a common noun, a verb or an interjection, depending on how it's used.

Yahweh and Jehovah are proper nouns, however English translations of the bible rarely, if ever, use these names, instead the bible mistakenly uses the words "god" and "lord" as proper nouns.

So you can blame John Wycliffe, Thomas Cranmer and all the other people throughout history that have translated the bible for butchering the English language.

If not a name, then "God" may still be considered a title, similar to General, and thus still a proper noun when referring to a specific being. (I'd compare it to a monarch, but those are arguably capitalized due to a self-deemed divine position. It's a tricky point there.)

Point taken.

Will do. You'd think that intelligent people would know not to mimic such bad English though.

Originally Posted by IGNIS

God
Lord

Also, you forgot to capitalize the word Bible in your post

Hrn. That's another thing which bugs me. "Bible" is a common noun, and so unless used as part of the proper noun "The Holy Bible", should be subject to all the same rules of English as the rest of the words I've addressed in this thread. I usually take exception though, as I've never heard the word bible used alone except when used as the title of this specific book. (even though it's still technically incorrect)



Oh, and the word "lord" being capitalized bugs me just as much as the titles of monarchs being capitalized. They only did it to sound holy.

But this, like "God", has times when it should have a capital and times when it shouldn't. More of the time it shouldn't though, I think.

I would go more in-depth but I will leave it at this: it's an idiosyncracy. Get over it.

Your argument is irrelevant. It is like saying that the Amish should be punished for speaking English that is peppered with Pennsylvania German. It is cultural, and it has stuck around in the protestant church for a while, for reasons I don't know and don't really matter. It has a set of rules that govern its usage, and it is used exclusively in religious context. It does not matter, and it does not affect you.

Even if it did affect you, it's inconsequential.

The silliness of targeting a religious group and calling its members "language butchers" because of its capitalization of pronouns in the context of its own privately practiced religion borders on trolling. I'm almost not sure if your intent is even serious.

In terms of pronouns: "he" is male, "she" is female, "He/She" is customarily used to refer to either a deity or occasionally another type of lord such as a king or a religious authority.

And besides, "He" is just as much a derivative of his title as anything else, since God as far as faith reveals has no true gender (and indeed could not).

Originally Posted by Leinator

Your argument is irrelevant. It is like saying that the Amish should be punished for speaking English that is peppered with Pennsylvania German. It is cultural, and it has stuck around in the protestant church for a while, for reasons I don't know and don't really matter. It has a set of rules that govern its usage, and it is used exclusively in religious context. It does not matter, and it does not affect you.

Even if it did affect you, it's inconsequential.

The silliness of targeting a religious group and calling its members "language butchers" because of its capitalization of pronouns in the context of its own privately practiced religion borders on trolling. I'm almost not sure if your intent is even serious.

It bugs me because it makes no sense to me, and obviously it can only bug me if I can see it (I don't go out looking for it, that's for sure). Therefore, it does affect me, even if not as much as I may have implied.



Also, I was and am quite serious about this, and had no intent on trolling.




But still, my aim here was not really to make people change how they do things, but moreso to find out why it's done in the first place. Looking at the posts so far, would it be fair to take the answer as "because that's how it's always been done"?

*Waves @Leininator*


@ Sabbo

I think you should research the origins of English capitalization rules and trace back when they started capitalizing the word "God" before you make that assumption.

Obviously the English language didn't always exist, and it especially hasn't always existed as is practiced today.

So my guess would be that the practice started anywhere from 3 AD - 10ooAD and became fully standardized by the late 1400's.

Generally, I refrain, just to be a dick. However, since it is (H/h)is name, I think it should be capitalized, just like we say, Harry Potter.

As for (H/h)e or (W/w)ord, no, thats dumb.

but "the Word" is still a proper noun. =/

ughh, this thread is turning me into a grammar nazi.

*legs start twitching......*


*Stechschritten*

DX

Originally Posted by Sabbo

It bugs me because it makes no sense to me, and obviously it can only bug me if I can see it (I don't go out looking for it, that's for sure). Therefore, it does affect me, even if not as much as I may have implied.

Unless you're a Christian, you will probably never be forced to use it. I'd also guess that most teachers in public schools (barring maybe the midwest) or colleges today wouldn't dock you points if you refused to use the "capitalization out of respect" rules of Christian culture. But again, it really is just culture.

But still, my aim here was not really to make people change how they do things, but moreso to find out why it's done in the first place. Looking at the posts so far, would it be fair to take the answer as "because that's how it's always been done"?

Perhaps a bit more complex than "because that's how it's always been done." It's a facet of religious culture that has remained intact in our society. It isn't so much different than, again, the Amish speaking Pennsylvania Dutch. It's an aspect of their culture that they've simply held onto. If you met an Amish person and heard him/her speaking Pennsylvania dutch, would you call them an "intelligent person mimicking bad English" or a "language butcher?"

Ever since I took German and Law in my A-Levels, I have a tendency to capitalise titles (it's somewhere between capitalising names in English and capitalising nouns in German, it seems). I also capitalise Justice when I'm speaking about the concept in its ultimate form, rather than "distributive justice" or any other sub-type.

i'm just going to stop capitalizing everything it is stupid anyway.

Actually, I recall reading in my English textbook in like 4th or 5th grade the capitalizing "Him" when referring to God is correct. And this was from a public school textbook! So, its really not butchering of the English language if the speakers of the English language think its correct.

However, I still believe it is rather silly.

I believe it's simply a sign of respect. Some people capitalize nouns that mean a lot to them, and I capitalize He, Him, etc. When talking about the Christian God, naturally His name should always be capitalized due to English grammar. Anything beyond that is the choice of the speaker. It's not really a big deal.

I will admit that I used to be one of those people who decapitalized the name of the Christian god intentionally, but after thinking about it I realized how silly this was. God is his name, and whether he exists or not is irrelevant regarding this

Just for the record, the Abrahamic God's name is not "God." His name is יהוה, transliterated YHVH.

Jews do not pronounce God's name. Many Christians don't either, though some do: Jehova and Yahweh are the primary attempts.