Israel

This is an issue dear to my heart, I believe that the Jews need a home,but they cannot continue their oppression of the Palestinians further - what are everyones views (If you want a more detailed version of my thoughts on this matter check out my YOUTUBE page on:YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

Originally Posted by AzaISaZELDALORD

This is an issue dear to my heart, I believe that the Jews need a home,but they cannot continue their oppression of the Palestinians further - what are everyones views (If you want a more detailed version of my thoughts on this matter check out my YOUTUBE page on:YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

I fully support Isreal, their kick ass military, and the short temper they have with incompetent countries.

Originally Posted by Flames of Valor

I fully support Isreal, their kick ass military, and the short temper they have with incompetent countries.

The ball game is a bit different when you're completely surrounded by hostiles and organizations that are dedicated towards your destruction.

I feel that they need to get the hell out.
I don't mean to sound racist or anything, but the middle east contains many people that simply do not want to.....move on.
Hell, many people there are still in tribes!

There will only be more death, destruction and war for Israel.....and it will only continue if they continue to stay there. Though that is asking much, it is the only real solution.
The middle east will never be stable, and it never has been.

Except for the half-millenia or so when it was first under Mameluk Egypt, and then under Ottoman Suzerainty, yes.

The Middle East has never been stable...



The real issue is how long will Arab/Iranian government propaganda continue to be effective and how long will it take for Israel to stand up to its fundamentalist settlers that it allows to illegally build new settlements against UN mandates and Roadmap to Peace plans.



And with a crumbing military as its junior officer programs stagnate, its Merkhavas proved susceptible to low-grade munitions, its potential threats fielding far more prepared and trained armies than they did in past decades, and a general degradation of the quality of the Israeli soldier, it'll have a long, bumpy road to travel.

My thinking is this: if you leave a queue and go back in a few hours time you cannot expect to go to the front - you have to start from the back again. so it is with the jews. They left/ were thrown out in the 1st century AD - what right do they have to go back in the 20th century and to oppress the inhabitants??

Of course the 3 billion they receive from the US government to spend on armaments doesn't help.

Do they need a country? Personally I think a non-secular government causes nothing bur trouble.

I've never been clear on why Israel was re-founded in the first place, I mean, their claim to the area is about as good as the Roman claim to Britain, but you don't see Italy petitioning to regain control of it.

read your history folks. Isreal never kicked out any palistinians when they moved in, the palisintians packed up and left at Isreal's founding, only to loose the war against them fighting alongside egypt, and then come back begging to be let back in claiming to be refugees.

Originally Posted by ChrisHoulihan

read your history folks. Isreal never kicked out any palistinians when they moved in, the palisintians packed up and left at Isreal's founding, only to loose the war against them fighting alongside egypt, and then come back begging to be let back in claiming to be refugees.

THAT IS THE ISRAELI LIE READ YOUR HISTORY LOOK AT HOW THE IRGUN AND STERN GANG MURDERED AND 'CLEARED' PALESTINIANS FROM THE LAND IN THE LATE 1940S

Originally Posted by AzaISaZELDALORD

THAT IS THE ISRAELI LIE READ YOUR HISTORY LOOK AT HOW THE IRGUN AND STERN GANG MURDERED AND 'CLEARED' PALESTINIANS FROM THE LAND IN THE LATE 1940S

And you don't think that at that very same time it was happening vice versa? Yeah, there are terrorist groups on both sides the only difference is that Israel actually takes effective measures to eliminate their own which is more than you can say for the other side.

Originally Posted by DakZhul

I feel that they need to get the hell out.
I don't mean to sound racist or anything, but the middle east contains many people that simply do not want to.....move on.
Hell, many people there are still in tribes!

There will only be more death, destruction and war for Israel.....and it will only continue if they continue to stay there. Though that is asking much, it is the only real solution.
The middle east will never be stable, and it never has been.

Ummm... didn't the Islamics ALSO migrate there?

Basicly, isn't it just two groups saying GTFO to each other?

I'm saying that if you're intelligent...to just get out of the middle east, period.
It may not be as bad as the media makes it out to be.

But the middle east is certainly not the most stable place on the planet, and I honestly do not think it will ever be stable either.
There's just too much history backing that up.

Originally Posted by Musky Melon

And you don't think that at that very same time it was happening vice versa? Yeah, there are terrorist groups on both sides the only difference is that Israel actually takes effective measures to eliminate their own which is more than you can say for the other side.

actually at that time it was not happening. the first arab agression came in 1949 - three years after the Jewish campaign of violence against the Palestinians had started...what more can be said.

Originally Posted by Master Jaken

Ummm... didn't the Islamics ALSO migrate there?

Basicly, isn't it just two groups saying GTFO to each other?

No they did not migrate there. The Jews migrated there in biblical times. They lived in Israel alongside with the ancestors of the Palestians in peace. then in about AD 70 the Jews left Israel. the Palestinians were still there. What happened about 500 years later is that Mohammed came and converted them to Islam. THEY DID NOT MOVE TO THE AREA THEY HAVE ALWAYS BEEN THERE!

Originally Posted by ChrisHoulihan

read your history folks. Isreal never kicked out any palistinians when they moved in, the palisintians packed up and left at Isreal's founding, only to loose the war against them fighting alongside egypt, and then come back begging to be let back in claiming to be refugees.

Not quite. There was a massive movement to force the Palestinians out. It wasn't government-sanctioned, but they didn't do anything about it, either.

Originally Posted by GDwarf

I've never been clear on why Israel was re-founded in the first place, I mean, their claim to the area is about as good as the Roman claim to Britain, but you don't see Italy petitioning to regain control of it.

Two or three reasons. The first being Israel is just that obvious a choice for a Jewish nation. It's really their only place they can claim historically. Because of which all Jews would gladly take the chance to settle down in Israel, 'land of their forefathers' and such. And except for the ultra-orthodox, many enjoy the chance to do so.

Then, there was already an attempt underway by the nationalist movement now known as Zionism, a secular group that sought to escape persecution of the Jewish ethnic groups of Europe by forging their own nation, that promoted immigration and settlement by Jews in the Levant. It was rather minor until WWII...


And then came the decision about what to do with all the displaced Jews and survivors of the Holocaust. We all know Hitler was the devil incarnate with a funny mustache, but many don't realize that most of Europe thought along the same lines as the Germans about the Jews - just not to the general extreme the Nazis believed. This includes Great Britain, who rather than take in any large number of Jewish refugees, started to send them down to Israel, their area of control according to UN mandate after WWI.


Those that didn't decide to go to Britain, and thus Israel, moved to the United States. It's why the vast majority of todays Jews are either Israeli or American. The rest are Russian and French, then the numbers dwindle quickly.