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Intolerant Secularists
Intollerance.
What do you think of when you hear this word? I think of fundamentalist christians. And indeed there are many narrow minded, dogmatic christians out there I am afraid to say. People who have no tollerance to respecting the beleifs and values of others. But I have noticed a growing thing. More and more I am seeing intollerance, narrow mindedness and dogmaticism from the secular end of the spectrum. Now most of the agnostics, secularists, and athiests on Zelda Universe have been quite reasonable and respectful and to many degrees tollerant. But I see most of these intollernat people on web sites like youtube, just looked at the many christian bashing, religion hating videos you will find there. What is it that changes a very reasonable, very respectful secularist(or athiest) person into an intollernt, hater? I admit there are many ignorant and narrow people in my own faith(christianity) but its begining to appear to me that there are even more on the other side of the spectrum.
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"If there are two things I hate the most, they are people in tollerant of other people's cultures and the dutch." (I'm dutch BTW)
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#2
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
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This is not to say there aren't mindful, tolerant atheists. Quite the opposite, there are many open minded, thoughtful atheists (I'm an atheist, and I really wouldn't consider myself militant), but it seems like their voices are muffled by the illogical intolerance created by a radical movement with no real point.
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#3
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
I'm an agnostic, and I like to consider myself tolerant. I don't "bash" religion for the sake of it like many of the people you described, but I will argue with it where I see flaws.
I think the main problem is that humanity seems to be degrading itself all the time. We seem to be breeding more and more brainless, intolerant pond life, who ruin good people's lives all the time, not just by intollerance. I conider that discrimination is on the increase, largely because people are too blind to see that a difference in sex, skin colour, sexuality, religion all do not make the slightest bit of difference. It is sad that the world has come to this, but I do not think it is secularists, atheists and agnostics who are to blame, I simply think there are more of them around now, so our views are more noticeable - particularly if we express them so appallingly.
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As of the 24th July, I'll be in France for five weeks. Bye bye people! (Might be stopping back a few times from cyber cafes and such though). Winner Best Dressed/Best Style, Best Writer, Best Poet Runner Up Most Intelligent/Mature, Master of the English Language, Most Likely to Become a Mod |

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#4
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
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I think a lot of secularists over there are just plain fed up with the power that religion has over their country, some to the point where they get vocal and start trying to fight against religious influence in their country. Some of these attempts would inevitably become misguided, making these people seem as intolerant as the groups/people they are trying to fight against in the first place. Well, that's how it seems to an outsider anyway.
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"Twilight Princess; it's 8 times longer than Wind Waker, with an 1/8 of the charm and fun!" The Return... Of Dr. Octagon! |

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#5
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
I will freely admit that there are intolerant atheists, people who don't believe religion simply because the like the idea of making fun of other people's beliefs. (The amount of anti-Islam feeling in some corners of the atheist groups is staggering.)
However, I suspect that most of this image of intolerance comes from one thing, that previously religion was considered sacrosanct, you weren't (aren't, really) supposed to question anyone's deeply held religious beliefs. Suddenly these atheists are doing just that. The thing is, in many cases, they aren't doing anything different from what people do to those who believe in bigfoot or aliens. They take a look at the evidence and say: "Well, no, your belief doesn't work." Now, they tend to be more emphatic than that, but the core of what they're saying is the same. I'd certainly say that Richard Dawkins falls under this category, not being intolerant, simply...argumentative. Now, Christopher Hitchens, on the other hand, I'm certain is very intolerant. So not even mainstream atheists are immune to it, alas. And yes, quite a bit of the stuff done by atheists in the US is done because they are current oppressed. Most of the "militant" atheists whose stuff I've read have, essentially, said that what they're doing is the same as any other human rights crusade, and that challenging the ideas of others (and even being rude) are nigh-essential parts of those. Anything similar you see in Canada is likely out of fear that we'll end up more like how the US is now.
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#6
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
Most all athiests who have an overriding hate for religion are in fact teenagers far too immature to have their opinions counted as anything more than a statistic. Far more so on Youtube, one of the internet's deepest pits of hell. So there is no general trend, and none to be wary of.
It's comparable to saying there is a disturbing trend of racism against African Americans simply from browsing 4chan. |

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#7
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
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I'd say that the point of it is the shock value and the general dada-esque mania which the Chans and especially the Anonymous group thrive on. Quote:
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![]() Sig by Andurhil, who is my personal ant hill. Step at your own risk. The Legend of the Green Leupak::The Adventure Starts Here "The meaning of life is that it ends." Franz Kafka Last edited by The Shademan; 12-06-2007 at 12:26 PM. |

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#8
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
Consider this: The truth itself is straight and narrow. Two plus two can't equal five, you will never fall up, and this forum does not have a yellow theme. Why should we be tolerant if the truth isn't? I don't know about atheists, but when we know what's right, why should we accept anything else?
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#9
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
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#10
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
I do, but that's beside the point. Everybody getting along... here? Yeah right. There is too much conflict here in this dimension for that to even be remotely possible. Besides, when it gets down to reality, it doesn't matter that we have peace here if it means more people go to hell. I couldn't live with myself if I knew I was responsible for someone going to hell because they never heard the truth from me.
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#11
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
Too much conflict - ergo there isn't tolerance.
__________________
As of the 24th July, I'll be in France for five weeks. Bye bye people! (Might be stopping back a few times from cyber cafes and such though). Winner Best Dressed/Best Style, Best Writer, Best Poet Runner Up Most Intelligent/Mature, Master of the English Language, Most Likely to Become a Mod |

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#12
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
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You do not know the truth. Nobody does. If nothing else, here is where I must side with the atheist philosophy. At least in most cases, they don't profess to absolutely know the truth. They admit a certain amount of doubt, but weigh the evidence and base their decision on that. |

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#13
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
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#14
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
The universe does not need a god to exist. And it certainly doesn't need the Christian god any more than it needs any other god.
Just because you say "evidence of god is everywhere" does not make it so. That's your perspective based on a belief system you were probably raised to believe in. |

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#15
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Re: Intolerant Secularists
Exactly. I'd rather have someone struggle with conflict for a several decades and go to heaven and then have eternal joy than have peace for their earthly life and go to hell to rot for the rest of eternity. It's a basic principal that enduring hardships now brings rewards later. As a very simple and small example, putting the milk up so it won't go sour. Everything in everything is modeled around this simple principal. Link goes and travels all around Hyrule, occasionally getting hurt, just to get the reward of saving his land. See? Literally everything.
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#16
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