Canadian and American Relations

Originally Posted by ChrisHoulihan

Were they from Canada? Yes. Were they from Britian? No. They were Canadians. Canada was not a british provience ever, but it was a colony, a colony called Canada. And the people who lived in this colony were called Canadians.

What flag did these "Canadians" march to battle under? If it was the Union Jack, then they were British.

Originally Posted by ChrisHoulihan

Did America take Canada? No. They failed. Was Canada sucessful in defending itself? Yes.

We succeeded in parts of the invasion. We got Lake Champlain, we just had to give it back in the Treaty of Ghent. I am not aurguing the point of Canada's defense. The war was still a draw simply because, neither side gained anything in terms of territory.

Originally Posted by ChrisHoulihan

Read more into your history, the bay of pigs was part of the cold war. Do some research into the Cuban missle crissis.

Again, as I said, the Cold War was between the USA and the USSR. Whose missles were being put on Cuba? The Soviet Union's. Who was operating these missle silos? Soviets.
Who was it that pulled the missiles of the island when the United States threatened to blow Russia off the face of the Earth? The Soviet Union. Cuba was caught in the middle.

Originally Posted by Strong Hammer

What flag did these "Canadians" march to battle under? If it was the Union Jack, then they were British.

Yes, the Canadians marched under the Union Jack, they were a British colony, but they were Upper and Lower Canada, they called themselves Canadian, they were Canadians. Just because you don't like to call them doesn't change fact, they were the nation of Canada, just not an independent nation.

Originally Posted by Strong Hammer

We succeeded in parts of the invasion. We got Lake Champlain, we just had to give it back in the Treaty of Ghent. I am not aurguing the point of Canada's defense. The war was still a draw simply because, neither side gained anything in terms of territory.

Your right the Americans, who attacked gained nothing, while the Canadians who defended lost mothing wich means the defense won, since they were attacked and they did not loose.

Originally Posted by Strong Hammer

Again, as I said, the Cold War was between the USA and the USSR. Whose missles were being put on Cuba? The Soviet Union's. Who was operating these missle silos? Soviets.
Who was it that pulled the missiles of the island when the United States threatened to blow Russia off the face of the Earth? The Soviet Union. Cuba was caught in the middle.

Cuba, had an alliance with U.S.S.R., they weren't caught in the middle, they were apart of the conflict.

I find it funny that you call, the USSR "Russia" even though they marched under the Hammer and Sickle. I would call them russian even though Russian was non existent at that time, but thats because I know they thought of themselves as russians, just as the canadians thought of themselves as canadian.

Originally Posted by dr_osprey

Yes, the Canadians marched under the Union Jack, they were a British colony, but they were Upper and Lower Canada, they called themselves Canadian, they were Canadians. Just because you don't like to call them doesn't change fact, they were the nation of Canada, just not an independent nation.

Yes but nationality wise, they were British. I live in Georgia, a state in the United States. People here call themselves Georgians, but that does not change the fact that we are Americans.

Originally Posted by dr_osprey

Your right the Americans, who attacked gained nothing, while the Canadians who defended lost mothing wich means the defense won, since they were attacked and they did not loose.

Untrue. We did gain territory during the course of the war. Maybe you missed that post about Lake Champlain. We gave it up as part of the Treaty of Ghent in order to secure an end to the war.

Originally Posted by dr_osprey

Cuba, had an alliance with U.S.S.R., they weren't caught in the middle, they were apart of the conflict.

Cuba was the perfect strategic location for SA nukes because they could hit as far up as Washington D.C. The Soviet Union recognized that. Notice how after Kennedy made his comment, Cuba got no more military support from the USSR.

Originally Posted by dr_osprey

I find it funny that you call, the USSR "Russia" even though they marched under the Hammer and Sickle. I would call them russian even though Russian was non existent at that time, but thats because I know they thought of themselves as russians, just as the canadians thought of themselves as canadian.

I find it funny that you put words in my mouth. I did not refer to the USSR as Russia. I said the USA threatened to blow Russia off the map. I said Russia because yes Russia existed under a socialist regeim which was the seat of government of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.

Originally Posted by Strong Hammer

Yes but nationality wise, they were British. I live in Georgia, a state in the United States. People here call themselves Georgians, but that does not change the fact that we are Americans.

Exactly, you finally get it! Your a Georgian, and an American, just as The Canadians of 1812 were British as well as Canadian.

Therefore, Canadians fought in the war of 1812 against American invasion, and the invasion failed. Canada won, end of story.

How about talking about somthing else involving American and Canadian relations?

I think it is sad that some Canadians and some Americans get on each other so much. The way I see it, Canada has it's qualities, and the United States has it's qualities. Why does one have to be superior to the other? They both are nations, so they both deserve respect.

(I noticed there was some questions regarding third parties in the U.S. There are actually many. Some of which are:the green party, libertarian party, constitution party, socialist party- and many others-Just wanted to inform people)

Originally Posted by Celticwolf

(I noticed there was some questions regarding third parties in the U.S. There are actually many. Some of which are:the green party, libertarian party, constitution party, socialist party- and many others-Just wanted to inform people)

It always seems like to me that there are only two parties. When they have the election for a president they only really talk about two canidates and the whole counrty is bassically divided into red and blue which represent those countries.

Originally Posted by ChrisHoulihan

It always seems like to me that there are only two parties. When they have the election for a president they only really talk about two canidates and the whole counrty is bassically divided into red and blue which represent those countries.

Yeah, we do have many parties, but the only two worth(the use of this word is ironic) voting for are the Republicrats and Demicans.


The War of 1812

A personal victory for the people of Canada, and a lost battle for the US. I'll give it that much.

The native Canadians at the time, under the flag of Britain, successfully defdended their homeland, so congrats to them.

The Americans, my ancestors, successfully defended their national sovereignty from Britain. So that was a victory for us.

On American and Canadian Relations

Prior to 9/11 I visited Canada briefly, and I found that what I saw was not that different from the United States. In truth I did not see much of the country, but what I did see was a nice place and if for some reason I could not live here, that is where I would go.

I do notice that many Canadians, Japanese, German, British, you name it... people are openly hostile towards the United States and especially any "ignorant" "bible-thumping" Americans who don't immediatly apologize for their tryanically country. Hypocrtical... and annoying... but I've learned to deal. For every one nasty Canadian out there I'm sure there are at least two or three polite ones.

Originally Posted by ChrisHoulihan

It always seems like to me that there are only two parties. When they have the election for a president they only really talk about two canidates and the whole counrty is bassically divided into red and blue which represent those countries.

That is because the third parties have been excluded from the major debates by the democrat and the republican parties. (I'm not sure why, they just do for some reason) Also, people do not know about them that well or do not vote for them because they figure they don't have a chance at winning. And that is true if people keep up that attitude. But if people gave them a chance as well, I'm certain there would be more colors showing up during elections.

Originally Posted by Celticwolf

That is because the third parties have been excluded from the major debates by the democrat and the republican parties. (I'm not sure why, they just do for some reason) Also, people do not know about them that well or do not vote for them because they figure they don't have a chance at winning. And that is true if people keep up that attitude. But if people gave them a chance as well, I'm certain there would be more colors showing up during elections.

This is why I said Canada was a multipary system, there are 4 partys that participate in the debates and all of them have representatives in government. There are even more parties than these 4 that may not at this time have reprsentatives.

Originally Posted by ChrisHoulihan

Exactly, you finally get it! Your a Georgian, and an American, just as The Canadians of 1812 were British as well as Canadian.
Therefore, Canadians fought in the war of 1812 against American invasion, and the invasion failed. Canada won, end of story.

How about talking about somthing else involving American and Canadian relations?

Canada did not win anything. America did not win anything. You cannot claim victory when you had to give up what you gained in order to end the war.

Internationally I am not recognized as a Georgian, but as an American. Internationally in the War of 1812, Canadians were not recognized as Canadians, but as Britins.

Canada does have good hockey teams though. I was suprised when they did not get a medal this time in the Olympics. Who did get medals?

Originally Posted by ChrisHoulihan

This is why I said Canada was a multipary system, there are 4 partys that participate in the debates and all of them have representatives in government. There are even more parties than these 4 that may not at this time have reprsentatives.

That's great. The third parties in the U.S do have their own debates, but I hope someday the other two parties will let them join them on the main ones, so there is more variety.

For every one nasty Canadian out there I'm sure there are at least two or three polite ones.

It's like that with Americans too; the nasty Americans just make so much noise that they can make everyone think they're the majority.

It always seems like to me that there are only two parties. When they have the election for a president they only really talk about two canidates and the whole counrty is bassically divided into red and blue which represent those countries.

The interesting thing about third-party candidates isn't that they have a chance at winning. Some citizens do know about parties other than the two main ones, and a popular third-party candidate can pull votes from one of the primary ones, thus moving the election in favor of the candidate who didn't lose votes to the third party. They may not win, but they can seriously affect who will.

As for the war of 1812:
America's still around
Britain's still around
Canada's around now
America didn't get Canada like it wanted, but Britain stopped kidnapping American sailors.
Britain didn't crush America like it wanted, but they got to keep Canada.
Canada didn't gain anything from the war, but they remained separate from America.
Nobody won; nobody lost. It's a draw.

As for political free religion:
I feel bad for Canada and Europe because their politicians can't be openly religious like ours can. Our politicians can pray, or say God Bless America, or what have you. They're not forcing you to pray with them - they're not forcing you to actually believe that their God will bless America - so why is it so bad? Nobody should have to surpress their religion because of what other people will think - not citizens, not politicians, not anyone.

And as for Canadians:
I've got nothing against you. You guys don't really affect me that much because I'm in the southern portion of America (and yet, ChrisHoulihan, please note that I do not say y'all or ain't or anything like that - that's a stereotype, which I believe you were vituperating someone for earlier...).

Thank you.

For those like me who always see the edited tag and wonder what was changed in the post: I edited a sentence when I realized that 'everynoe' was, regretfully, not a word.

Originally Posted by Strong Hammer

Canada does have good hockey teams though. I was suprised when they did not get a medal this time in the Olympics. Who did get medals?

We did win the gold medal in hockey. Women's hockey. Sweden won the gold for the men's hockey.

Originally Posted by Galedeep

We did win the gold medal in hockey. Women's hockey. Sweden won the gold for the men's hockey.

Sweden?! I was hoping Russia would have gotten it. That is how my favorites fall into secession, USA (home first and foremost), Canada (being our next door neighbor) and Russia (I just kinda like them for some reason). That is disappointing.

Originally Posted by Tiberius

As for political free religion:
I feel bad for Canada and Europe because their politicians can't be openly religious like ours can. Our politicians can pray, or say God Bless America, or what have you. They're not forcing you to pray with them - they're not forcing you to actually believe that their God will bless America - so why is it so bad? Nobody should have to surpress their religion because of what other people will think - not citizens, not politicians, not anyone.

I totaly agree with you on this, Canadian polititions don't have very much religious freedom, Im hoping this will change with our new PM Steven Harper, he seems to have enough bravery to wish people a merry Christmas which is a pretty big step for federal polititions in Canada. Harper is christian and should be able to say it, the same goes for a Muslim, Jewish, Budist etc...

That is because the third parties have been excluded from the major debates by the democrat and the republican parties.

Probably because of the media. The media rarely even speaks about people from the other parties, so nobody knows about them.

Harper is christian and should be able to say it, the same goes for a Muslim, Jewish, Budist etc...

Unfortunately, many people think differently. It's possibly only a matter of time before this kind of thing is looked down upon in Canada.

Originally Posted by D3PyroGS

Unfortunately, many people think differently. It's possibly only a matter of time before this kind of thing is looked down upon in Canada.

It is widely looked down upon in Canada, Im just hoping it will change.