Proud to be American?

I honestly feel like America isn't as free as perhaps most Americans think. The power that the police abuse there is ridiculous. In countries like Australia, New Zealand and even the UK this is rarely seen, add to that several other countries from Europe and the like. It's free, but you sure as hell pay for it sometimes.

@Patriotism: I'm of the mind that patriotism is not a bad thing; as long as you appreciate what good you find in your country, let it be the language, the food, the people or certain places you like and if that makes you proud of your country, then great. I heavily frown upon those who insult other countries in their pride. In one sentence: patriotism is when you love your country, nationalism is when you hate others.

@America: I genuinely can't say I agree with many things that happen there - but at the same time I don't believe in the collective hatred that it gets from... everywhere; well I do notice it in Europe. That's senseless and woefully ignorant.

Patriotism... Patriotism is important, as long as it is for good, well considered reasons. I'm a patriotic person because, after a long think, I've decided there're very few countries in which I wouldn't feel like I'd taken a step down- namely Australia, Canada, and Switzerland*- and even then I only consider them on-par.



*For those of you who are wondering why America doesn't appear here, I have two words for you: Bible Belt.

No, I'm not proud to be American. However, if I was British, I wouldn't be proud to be that either. Or any other nationality. Thinking you should be proud just because you happened to be born in a certain place is just stupid. You didn't make a choice to be born in that country, you did nothing to earn it, so thinking that you are superior to someone who is not from that country is just idiotic.

Really, the only ones who actually have a right to be proud to be American are immigrants to America; they actually did something to earn the right to be called American.

It's just as much a choice to remain an American than it is to immigrate.

And of course, I do something that enables me to be proud of my country. I pay my taxes and participate in the democratic process.

I'm grateful/happy to be an American, but not particularly proud of it. My birth here was a random occurrence. I played no meaningful role in the development of this country. To be proud of something implies you took a part in it. I think people get overly sentimental about what is nothing more than an accident of birth. Patriotism is a farce and a potentially dividing force.

And having said that, I'd be just happy to be a Canadian, Brit, German, Austrailian . . . basically anywhere that honors personal liberties and democracy and enjoys a 1st world standard of living.

I like living here. America, like all nations, has its flaws, which can stand to be fixed. We have done some really stupid stuff in our history, but again, so have a lot of countries. I am certain there are a few things to be proud of. Not everything we do is bad. I mean, living here is certainly better than living in a country with absolutely no freedom, or a poor country.

I'm glad to be living here, but I could just as easily be living in Canada. So I'm not particularly grateful or proud of being a resident of America.

As for being proud to be an American - aw, hell nah. I would be proud to be an America if it still adhered to the principles it was founded upon (as flawed as some were, they were better than what we got now). "American" today is very different from "American" of old. I try my hardest to distance myself from being considered American and am not very proud of the country or it's people.

I'm only patriotic during the Olympics.

'Cause that's what that ♥♥♥♥'s for.

Not American so I wouldn't know. But I don't have anything against the US, so I guess so.

Alright. Let me give you my view on the matter.

I think that the US was founded on wonderful ideology. Getting away from the tyranny of England was great. I think that the intentions were great, but I am not proud of being American. Why be proud of nationality? I think that the US is digging a ditch that will kill the nation. It is economically struggling (much like other nations), and China owns our debt.



We are spending like crazy on things such as education. We have, at least, doubled our spending on education.



I honour the troops, I respect the flag, I am not proud of being American. I am proud of being in a first world nation.

I think that the US is digging a ditch that will kill the nation. It is economically struggling (much like other nations), and China owns our debt.

Two- three things I need to mention:

1) China only owns 8% of American debt.

2) This obstacle is by no means insurmountable. It simply requires a drop of political will to affect obvious solutions.

3) The Chinese economy only works by dragging the rest of the world down through underpriced labour. Take away the buyers i.e the now struggling West, and China quickly will go down ♥♥♥♥ creek without a paddle.

---------- Post added at 07:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:39 PM ----------

We are spending like crazy on things such as education. We have, at least, doubled our spending on education.

what's wrong with spending on education?

Originally Posted by Cor Sicarius

We are spending like crazy on things such as education. We have, at least, doubled our spending on education.

Why is that a bad thing though? People say that Americans are not smart at all, and when we take the initiative to make our people smarter, we're criticized for spending too much?

Originally Posted by Great White North

1) China only owns 8% of American debt.

Hmm... didn't know this.

Also, this is interesting. China doesn't own nearly as much as I thought it did.



This is my point though

2) This obstacle is by no means insurmountable. It simply requires a drop of political will to affect obvious solutions.

What are your thoughts of a solution?

3) The Chinese economy only works by dragging the rest of the world down through underpriced labour. Take away the buyers i.e the now struggling West, and China quickly will go down ♥♥♥♥ creek without a paddle.

Agreed.

what's wrong with spending on education?

Absolutely nothing. If you saw the graph, you could see how America is spending a lot more money on education without major improvement.

Originally Posted by Radek

As for being proud to be an American - aw, hell nah. I would be proud to be an America if it still adhered to the principles it was founded upon (as flawed as some were, they were better than what we got now). "American" today is very different from "American" of old.

Is it? There was always racism, always conformity, always violations of civil liberties, always intolerance against foreigners, always the desire to destroy the wilderness and nature in exchange for personal wealth, etc. The key difference is now America's industrialized. Granted, one had a far better chance of moving up in the pre-Civil War America, as industrialization had really not fully hit America (Yes, there was the Industrial Revolution, but I'm thinking more along the lines of the Second Industrial Revolution and urbanization). We are much more materialistic on a massive scale than they were, but that really started with the 1920s and 1950s.

Absolutely nothing. If you saw the graph, you could see how America is spending a lot more money on education without major improvement.

Because we're using an outdated system and NCLB fails to provide the needed reform for improvement.

What are your thoughts of a solution?

A combination of tax hikes, spending cuts, tax reform, and institutional reform.

Absolutely nothing. If you saw the graph, you could see how America is spending a lot more money on education without major improvement.

Then that's an issue of methods, not resources.

Originally Posted by Great White North

A combination of tax hikes, spending cuts, tax reform, and institutional reform.

I know this isn't the place for a conversation about spending, but I have an idea in mind.

Then that's an issue of methods, not resources.

Explain, please.

Originally Posted by MorbidDelight

Is it? There was always racism, always conformity, always violations of civil liberties, always intolerance against foreigners, always the desire to destroy the wilderness and nature in exchange for personal wealth, etc.

you just described literally every country
why would any of those things make america any worse in relation to any other country

Originally Posted by mattj

you just described literally every country
why would any of those things make america any worse in relation to any other country

That wasn't the point. Their point was that America used to be better than it currently is. Even when you adjust things for the time periods (if that makes sense), the past is just as screwed up as today is.

As for why America's worse than other countries today, there's a pool of reasons. Crappy education system, crappy immigration system, the idolization of guns, crappy social welfare system, etc.

Explain, please.

It means there's a fundamental issue not with supply (the amount of money and resources available), but rather with structure (the system itself).