Schooling Systems

okay well I do believe there are some significantly wrong things with Britain's educational system with regards to how it works. The primary problem is that it allows slackers to progress with GCSEs(13-16 qualifications) and put absolutely no effort in. It's incredibly unfair to the people(like me) who actually put effort into their schoolwork and try to make something of their education.

Now this wouldn't be much of a problem until later life, only these sort of people actively disrupt the learning of other people too. In most of my subjects I am paired with a range of people, and usually people take the side of slacking because they have majority. It means that the education of anyone who does want to learn is screwed, as the teacher has to spend their time either helping the other people with their work, or arguing back and forth.

In America they tried to combat laziness and disruptiveness with the idea of holding people back a year, or advancing them a year if they work hard(according to people I've asked). I do actually like this idea a lot, I'm sure it has it's downsides and misjudgements could cause error, but for the most part it looks a sound system. If I was ever in a seat of power, I would definitely be pushing for this to be adapted.

the other solution, which is actually being put into place by Mr. Goves, who is the current Secretary for Education(?). A short while ago he released a statement along the lines of "Prepare to fail". Grade boundaries will no longer be moved about and exams will be harder, and as I've already seen in my maths lessons the curriculum has changed so that it is testing our understanding of maths during an exam with "starred questions", which require instructions as to how you completed the question, as well as others.

So, what do you think the education system of yours, or others, and what could be done to improve it?

Originally Posted by Keith

okay well I do believe there are some significantly wrong things with Britain's educational system with regards to how it works. The primary problem is that it allows slackers to progress with GCSEs(13-16 qualifications) and put absolutely no effort in. It's incredibly unfair to the people(like me) who actually put effort into their schoolwork and try to make something of their education.

Now this wouldn't be much of a problem until later life, only these sort of people actively disrupt the learning of other people too. In most of my subjects I am paired with a range of people, and usually people take the side of slacking because they have majority. It means that the education of anyone who does want to learn is screwed, as the teacher has to spend their time either helping the other people with their work, or arguing back and forth.

In America they tried to combat laziness and disruptiveness with the idea of holding people back a year, or advancing them a year if they work hard(according to people I've asked). I do actually like this idea a lot, I'm sure it has it's downsides and misjudgements could cause error, but for the most part it looks a sound system. If I was ever in a seat of power, I would definitely be pushing for this to be adapted.

the other solution, which is actually being put into place by Mr. Goves, who is the current Secretary for Education(?). A short while ago he released a statement along the lines of "Prepare to fail". Grade boundaries will no longer be moved about and exams will be harder, and as I've already seen in my maths lessons the curriculum has changed so that it is testing our understanding of maths during an exam with "starred questions", which require instructions as to how you completed the question, as well as others.

So, what do you think the education system of yours, or others, and what could be done to improve it?

I think the education system here in America -- and likely many others in the world, are undermined by the families and people raising the children in this country, and in other countries. It will be difficult to aid the school systems without first dealing with the bedrock of society that it invariably must stand upon. Many of the bad decisions our education administrators have made have been based on the idea we can cope with stupidity, laziness, and ignorance. I can't judge them for trying; but the system is not ideal.

Naturally the British Public School system is the model to be emulated everywhere.

The Grammar model worked nicely too.

This video articulates my views much better than I could.

on a less serious note:

Spoiler:  

kill people burn ♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥ school!

Originally Posted by Keith

Location: Liverpool

I'm so sorry.

I agree with FoV on this, that the faults with the education system lie with society, and generally what kind of future people have to look forward to. Take for example your unfortunate home city of Liverpool. Crippled by mistress Thatcher, many kids there don't see the point in an education, especially considering that there is no use in the region for trained workers. I know a lass from Liverpool who can strip down, rebuild, and program virtually any type of computer circa the late 1980's onwards (her favourite being old Atari systems), and yet she's been unemployed for two years.
What's the point of these kids concentrating in class, when they have no future anyway?

C'mon guys, at least we have schooling systems! What about the kinds in all the 3rd world countries? Even some 1st world countries have little to no actual schooling system!!

So just because we're in a better situation than some others we shouldn't try to improve ourselves?

The education system is ♥♥♥♥, I haven't put any effort into my work since high school and I still maintain good grades. Because simply education doesn't encourage critical thinking or creativity, it encourages memorization and that is even more apparent in university when most of your grades are derived from multiple choice exams. I'm blessed with a good memory and as a result I get good grades.

That was one of the reasons I hated highschool when studying for GCSEs. You were put into a class of 30 or more where the majority would conform to social groups and not to the actual lessons.

Now, what I liked about college (studying higher education) was that classes were around 15 and this number decreased throughout the course - people who were committed stayed and the "slackers" eventually dropped out because they either failed or couldn't be bothered to continue with the workload.

It's a shame highschool is compulsory because if it wasn't it would certainly sort those who want to learn from those who don't.

The *public* school system needs to serve the public as a whole, and being realistic that involves providing a baby-sitting service capable of shunting bodies into appropriate professional programs and trades as quickly as possible and perhaps providing a modicum of cultural education. Nothing more can reasonably be charged to the public account.

Investing tax-dollars in an attempt to create young erudites works out poorly for everyone involved. The way the system is set up now, good students are encouraged to avoid legitimate professional training for as long as possible and end up financial black-holes without any gain in employable assets. When US student loan debt eclipses credit card debt and a Bachelor's degree no longer constitutes a competitive advantage in the job market, it's time to start thinking that maybe, as far as education is concerned, less is more.

Now, I get where the entitlement comes from. A teacher in any capacity is, of course, going to prefer working with a student who wants to learn... and constantly encouraging that attitude starts to sounds like a guarantee from the system. But honestly, while "Learning for the love of knowledge" is one of the more noble of hobbies it's still a hobby; something that you should do on you own time, on your own dime, and with realistically minor expectations of economic compensation.

From what I've learnt in my German lessons, the German education system seems pretty solid. You have your Realschule, it's pretty much a comprehensive school (though I'm under the impression they're better). Then below that you have the Hauptschule which is where you learn the fundamental subjects, but also more practical skill based things. Then there's the Gymnasium which is like a grammar school. The harder working, more academic kids get into these schools. And finally you have the Gesamtschule which is a combination of all three.

This is what the British education system is lacking, choice. Grammar schools are pretty much dead save for some areas of Buckinghamshire and there's nothing like the Hauptschule until after you pass your GCSEs. The German system seems much more fair as those who are intelligent can still get a good education in a better environment. A private education is still probably the best choice, but of course that's not going to be a viable option for many families.

Originally Posted by MagicBean

Then there's the Gymnasium which is like a grammar school. The harder working, more academic kids get into these schools.

We have the mixture of German and Prussian education system in Hungary and I would like to enrich this otherwise excellent post with an additional personal information.

I currently go to a Gymnasium. It is true that it has kids with academic interest and more talent; but given by the small number of such institutions, the number of children in a class is ridiculously high. My class consists of 38 students, which counts as low, as it is normal to have up 45-50 children in a class - I think it's terrible and makes it hard to verse students. Behavioral problems occur quite often - see below.

Another issue is that even at a Gymnasium, the interests are very varied. One kid is interested in Science, the other is interested in Humanities; yet we hardly have a choice to decide which lessons we want to take. As this is a Gymnasium, they find it important that we are well-educated, even if it includes redundant lessons - such as organic chemistry in my case, as I'm Humanities-oriented. We learn about subjects in such detail that I find greatly unnecessary (even if it IS interesting to learn about them). I reckon it would be much better if we could decide what subjects we want to have more lessons in and specialise like that. The reason why I think this is that a Science-oriented student won't listen on Literature lesson and vice versa; and yes, it ends up in behavioral problems, which I believe could be avoided.



I am not saying it is better/worse than the British one, I just wanted to share that as much as the German model might seem nice, it has its flaws as well. :>

Originally Posted by Neshi

My class consists of 38 students, which counts as low, as it is normal to have up 45-50 children in a class - I think it's terrible and makes it hard to verse students. Behavioral problems occur quite often - see below.

50 students?! That must be pretty hard on the teacher. Or do you have multiple teachers per class?

And I figured as much that the system isn't perfect, but the concept itself seems good.

Im not in favor for skipping classes as I believe school is much more than learning. It is also an important social meeting place for kids or young adults. Of course that can backfire too thinking bullying and such.

I believe alot of problems lies with the parents when it comes to the eductaion part. Parents sends their kids to school and many of them believes that their child will educate themselves. Parents should get a pre-school course where they learn to give their child certain demands regarding grades and behavior based on whatever conditions they might have.