Drugs

I apologize in advance if this is inappropriate for these boards. I haven't seen any threads regarding the legal status of drugs in the country -- specifically marijuana.

So, I've been known to occasionally smoke the bud with friends. It's a fun hobby for me that I don't do too often, but when I do I do it with a very close group of friends that I trust (meaning we've all agreed we don't want to do any harder drugs and there will be no peer pressure in the group for those types of things). I personally see it as less harmless than cigarettes and FAR less of a threat than alcohol currently is. I'm of the opinion we should legalize pot and crack down even more on alcohol.

Given that the legality of marijuana has recently been debated at the national level in the U.S., what are your opinions on not only marijuana but possibly other drugs that aren't necessarily as harmful as people tend to think?

Discuss.

Legalization.

- It will be taxed of course, creating copious amounts of revenue for a government.
- Has medical usage, ranging from aid in coping with pain to helping one sleep.
- Money and prison space will no longer be wasted on people convicted of possession.
- People who only smoke weed will no longer have to go through dealers, which could lead to them trying harder, dangerous drugs.
- I imagine hemp would be legal as well. Hemp is nice.
- Not anywhere near as damaging as nicotine; the effects of being high are much less severe than being drunk.

Finally, for the regular person, it's a nice little thing to have at the end of the day, when all responsibilities are taken care, to just sit down and smoke a little to relax, and enjoy life a little more.



tl;dr, literally no reason for it to continue being illegal.

Here are some of my thoughts:

- Marijuana should be legalized for recreational and medical use (with age restrictions of course)

- Marijuana, alcohol, and all tobacco products should be taxed heavily

- A license should be required to grow marijuana, manufacture marijuana products, distribute marijuana products, and possibly even to work with marijuana.

- Anyone found doing the above things without the license should be fined or worse depending on the severity of the act. I believe similar things are set in place for alcohol and tobacco products, correct? Like selling to minors.

- Laws should be put in place for where you can smoke, just like laws are in place for where you can and can not drink alcohol.

I also agree that marijuana has less physical harm potential than alcohol and quite possibly less potential for addiction. There are plenty of credible studies showing this that can be found by simply searching the web.

I don't smoke or drink, but I do know a bit about the subject.

- It will be taxed of course, creating copious amounts of revenue for a government.

We would be out of our issues as a nation if they just did this. Freaking hell! Hell even my own mum is for legalizing the Mary Jane for this reason and a few other reasons.

-Marijuana is generally considered to be less damaging to the body than alcohol or tobacco.

-Legalized marijuana would reduce the flow of money from the American economy to international criminal gangs.

-Marijuana's legalization would simplify the development of hemp as a valuable and diverse agricultural crop in the United States, including its development as a new bio-fuel to reduce carbon emissions.

-The product could be regulated, taxed, and sold just like tobacco. The tax revenue would be enormous.

-The "war on drugs" has proven to be a complete failure. Legalization of marijuana would allow the DEA and local law enforcement to focus on catching people peddling hard drugs instead of wasting time tracking down pot dealers.

-The FDA or others could regulate the quality and potency of the substance.

I don't think drug laws work. Those who follow the laws probably wouldn't use drugs even if they were legal. Those who want to do drugs are going to break the law anyway. Thus, all drug laws do is waste money, police resources, and jail space on people who are only hurting themselves and aren't a threat to anybody's safety.

I personally would not do drugs even if they were legal. I think doing them is dangerous and stupid. However, I think gambling is dangerous and stupid as well, and I definitely think it should be legal. I feel the same way about drugs.

As long as people are informed of the risk, and they sign something that says they or their family won't sue the seller if they suffer an overdose, I see no reason people shouldn't be allowed to muse any drugs they want. The government could make money off of a tax on drugs, and legalizing drugs for sale would mean that the criminal elements surrounding the drug trade would go away. The only restriction I'd place on them is require users to be over a certain age.

Just earlier tonight I smoked up with my cousin, his wife, and her friends. We then played some Mario Kart Wii. I got a little loopy, though, since I so rarely smoke.

Everyone above me has done a great job of outlining why it should be legal. And I honestly do think it's only a matter of time (and not much time, at that). I don't think I'll ever get a prescription for it, even though it would probably help, and I probably wont smoke it more than I do now. But seriously, wtf government? Seriously?

Originally Posted by Gamzee

- People who only smoke weed will no longer have to go through dealers, which could lead to them trying harder, dangerous drugs.

Given the heavy social stigma in the US, I wouldn't be so sure or sloppy with your argument.

Originally Posted by Armillary

-The product could be regulated, taxed, and sold just like tobacco. The tax revenue would be enormous.

-The "war on drugs" has proven to be a complete failure. Legalization of marijuana would allow the DEA and local law enforcement to focus on catching people peddling hard drugs instead of wasting time tracking down pot dealers.

It's called weed for a reason. I can grow almost everywhere. The reason why companies were able to regulate and monopolize tobacco? It's not easy to grow.

Means to an end. There are so many OTC drugs that have the same effects as the illegal ones: Dramamine, Motrin IB, anything that contains DXM, even Camphor. If someone wants to get a high, they will.

Everything in moderation.

That's a false compromise, ergo a fallacy.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

Given the heavy social stigma in the US, I wouldn't be so sure or sloppy with your argument.

Neither should you.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

It's called weed for a reason. I can grow almost everywhere. The reason why companies were able to regulate and monopolize tobacco? It's not easy to grow.

The reason why companies were able to regulate and "monopolize" tobacco is because it was widely used and eventually considered a controlled substance, not because it requires a lot of work to produce.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

Means to an end. There are so many OTC drugs that have the same effects as the illegal ones: Dramamine, Motrin IB, anything that contains DXM, even Camphor. If someone wants to get a high, they will.

How is this a response to what I posted? I said nothing about trying to change a persons desire to get high.

Originally Posted by Armillary

The "war on drugs" has proven to be a complete failure. Legalization of marijuana would allow the DEA and local law enforcement to focus on catching people peddling hard drugs instead of wasting time tracking down pot dealers.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

It's called weed for a reason. I can grow almost everywhere. The reason why companies were able to regulate and monopolize tobacco? It's not easy to grow.

Easy to grow vegetables are mostly grown by massive farms as well.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

Given the heavy social stigma in the US, I wouldn't be so sure or sloppy with your argument.

I wasn't aware this was strictly for the US.

I also don't see where you're going with this. People who only smoke weed would be able to get it from a shop or a dispenser of some sort, cutting out drug dealers (who could potentially be selling other drugs such as cocaine). That part of it would be out of the equation. Someone who smokes would then need to go out of their way to find someone to sell them xanex or ecstasy or cocaine or heroin, as opposed to going down the street to a weed shop.

Peer pressure still exists, if that's what you were talking about.

I am in agreement with most of this. I think taxation and regulation would be an excellent source of revenue.

However I will ignore the savings from the police force by using it on education. I have seen people completely over use the stuff and become lazy and incapable of holding down a job. The worst example was when I worked in a hostel changing beds, a guy I worked with just couldn't do anything and all we were doing was making beds. Granted I have seen far, far worse things come from alcohol and tobacco (one reason I am for legalization) but that doesn't make better downsides good. The human body has the ability to be addicted to many things that don't themselves contain properties of being addictive.

So therefore as I said I would use money to educate about use in moderation and support clinics to help people who feel they've lost control or feel they turn to it far too easily.

There are also other factors I agree with legislation including with Gamzee's statement that it would reduce the chances of it being a gateway drug as the environment of going to dealers would not be established by its use.

Originally Posted by Armillary

Neither should you.

And here I thought you were capable of presenting more than an ad hominem.

The reason why companies were able to regulate and "monopolize" tobacco is because it was widely used and eventually considered a controlled substance, not because it requires a lot of work to produce.

You're not following the previous train of thought; we were discussing taxation of marijuana. It's a non sequitur. You implied marijuana should be legalized and consequently taxed, but taxation and regulation are practically impossible due to weed's fertility, leaving people to grow and eventually maintain their own stash of Mysterious Plant Life.

How is this a response to what I posted? I said nothing about trying to change a persons desire to get high.

Yeah, I'm sorry about that. I quoted the wrong paragraph.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

You're not following the previous train of thought; we were discussing taxation of marijuana. It's a non sequitur. You implied marijuana should be legalized and consequently taxed, but taxation and regulation are practically impossible due to weed's fertility, leaving people to grow and eventually maintain their own stash of Mysterious Plant Life.

Do you really think that if it was illegal to grow weed (which it would be if it was regulated) people would rather break the law and buy it from someone who grows it than buy it from a legalized seller? There would have to be an absolutely massive price difference and if it is grown in vast quantities by companies they would be able to seller for much less of a profit because they can get larger accumulative profit over many sales. Though even if there was a massive price difference it's not like buying a bootleg DVD when if you get a bad copy the worst this is a fuzzy movie. People will and do pay more for the assurances that they know how things they are going to put in there body are grown, what chemicals are used and that it meets safety regulation. Others may also be put off from the illegality prospect.

While I do agree that at the beginning the illegal side would remain high and I'm not against those who grow for themselves but I think over time the illegale side would become as big an issue as black market potato sellers.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

And here I thought you were capable of presenting more than an ad hominem.You're not following the previous train of thought; we were discussing taxation of marijuana. It's a non sequitur. You implied marijuana should be legalized and consequently taxed, but taxation and regulation are practically impossible due to weed's fertility, leaving people to grow and eventually maintain their own stash of Mysterious Plant Life.

I replied to the thread before you did.

I think Johnny tied this up nicely for you. ^^^^^^

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

Yeah, I'm sorry about that. I quoted the wrong paragraph.

Mind posting the one you meant to quote?

Originally Posted by Jonny

Do you really think that is it was illegal to grow weed (which it would be if it was regulated) people would rather break the law and buy it from someone who grows it than buy it from a legalized seller? There would have to be an absolutely massive price difference and if it is grown in vast quantities by companies they would be able to seller for much less of a profit because they can get larger accumulative profit over many sales. Though even if there was a massive price difference it's not like buying a bootleg DVD when if you get a bad copy the worst this is a fuzzy movie. People will and do pay more for the assurances that they know how things they are going to put in there body are grown, what chemicals are used and that it meets safety regulation. Others may also be put off from the illegality prospect.

Every argument I present might delude you into thinking I'm against legalization. I'm not; I just enjoy playing devil's advocate.

I'm going to be frank: Where I live, that's the case. Look it up: Belgium.

Armillary, allow me ask you this question: how do you intend to tax and regulate a drug that people can grow and maintain themselves? How would the government catch substance abusers, specifically hard drugs addicts, when certain pharmaceutical OTC drugs have a similar impact upon a person's health and well-being? How would one differentiate between an abuser or a patient in dire need?

If marijuana is legalized, how will the DEA and local law enforcement focus on catching people who peddle hard drugs?

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

I just enjoy playing devil's advocate.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

Armillary, allow me ask you this question: how do you intend to tax and regulate a drug that people can grow and maintain themselves?

The same way we regulate and tax tobacco. There is little incentive to grow it yourself and face prosecution when you can purchase it at your local gas station.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

How would the government catch substance abusers, specifically hard drugs addicts, when certain pharmaceutical OTC drugs have a similar impact upon a person's health and well-being?

When I say "hard drugs" I'm not talking about OTC pharmaceuticals.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

How would one differentiate between an abuser or a patient in dire need?

I was talking specifically about marijuana.

Originally Posted by Yog-Sothoth

If marijuana is legalized, how will the DEA and local law enforcement focus on catching people who peddle hard drugs?

Instead of spending time worrying about marijuana smokers they would focus on catching people who sell more dangerous drugs.

Make possession of all drugs legal except when they would be considered poisons(I'm guessing some poisons are illegal to own in bulk). Put the drugs through the FDA and regulate their sale.