Stone Tower of Babel: Why Termina was Doomed

I don't think the statues resemble the giants at all. The faces of the giants and the statue faces are much different, and when did the giants have torsos like the statues do?
This really is all interpretation.

Have you ever read the Majora's Mask manga? There was one.

At the very end it had a bonus story. I can't really think of it all off the top of my head, but there was a hero, or traveller, or something. And this demon. Apparently, he ate people. The ones that wanted his armor, scale, thingies. Something like that.

Then they talked and blah.

Something happens.

And the guy plays a song, I believe. On a harp. The monster dances and dances and eventually dies. Then the man, who defeated the monster, took off one of the monster's armor things and made the Majora's Mask.

Sorry for any inaccuracy. I'm sure I'm close to the story.

But that's where the mask comes from. I'm sure that fits into your story somehow.

I'm really impressed you found out so much, though.

That is an excellent theory, and it makes me think of the game differently. This should be moved to Timeline and Other Theories.

Do you have any thoughts about the theory that the Fierce Diety is Majora's rival? You didn't mention him in it, and I believe he plays a significant part in Majora's story.

Good theory, explains alot , though some is left in the dark, I will research this further.

Cheers,

Joe

Originally Posted by Daphnes

Do you have any thoughts about the theory that the Fierce Diety is Majora's rival? You didn't mention him in it, and I believe he plays a significant part in Majora's story.

The Fierce Deity subject pretty much has me stumped. The game provides very little info, even contradictory info, about the being and it's mask. I'm not too fond of the FD Mask since it ruined the final battle for many people, so I don't really think about it as much as I do things like the Stone Tower, which is my favorite stage of the Zelda series.

LeondraBeth, I've read the manga. That manga was an interpretation of MM by an outside artist, so it's sort of official fan-fiction, not an acceptable part of MM's story. For instance, the portrayal of the Mask Salesman blatantly contradicted his role in the game. The background story was interesting and I liked it, but I don't consider it to be true.

Welcome to the forums, by the way.

Haha, thanks. =3

I just thought that it might have been an important part. Oh well. <3

But this is great. I never even noticed that until now. Thanks for pointing it out. XD

He's not talking like that, he's talking about cause and effect. READ THE REST OF THIS THREAD BEFORE YOU GO SHOOTING YOUR MOUTH OFF.

This is an amazing theory, I almost never read these theories and I stumbled across this one by luck.

It is amazing, though I don't know what a phallus is (Don't laugh at me)

Edit: Never mind, I know what it is

Wow, excellent theory. I also don't often read such theories as much as I used to, but I'm glad that I stumbled upon this one. Stuff like this is the main reason that I love Majora's Mask so much; it's shrouded in a lot of mysteries, all of which are just begging the players to theorize its history and such. Wouldn't call it a fan-fiction, either. There's certainly a great degree of speculation, but the provided evidence is definitely enough to make the theory feel realistic.
Loving the idea of a rebellion against the Goddesses, which in turn cursed the fate of Termina.

Also of note is the music that plays during the Stone Tower temple. The Stone Tower track has a very somber tone to it, which I think supports this theory as well, what with the tragedy of Termina's fate as a result of the ancient peoples' blasphemy.
The Inverted Stone Tower Temple music features an even more mysterious atmosphere, which really adds to the feeling that you're in another world. Certainly, that could support the theory of the temple's path to Termina's Hell (or the lair in which Majora was discovered, anyway).

And so my urge to replay Majora's Mask rises.

Speaking of the music, at the game music remix site vgmix.com (which is down until early next year) there was a remixed song titled "Building the Stone Tower of Babel". I listened to it once years ago but I forget what I thought of it. I remember I thought the title and description of it were odd.

The Stone Tower music is one of my favorite themes in the game. It's addictive but unsettling. I don't know if this is the right way to describe it, but it seems like there's something sinister below the surface, like the Clock Town Day Three theme.

Your post made me want to go back to the Stone Tower yet again, and this time I had another "Holy crap!" moment. A person had brought this up at another forum, but I didn't really get what he was talking about then. In the first room of the temple, there is a gigantic statue of a deformed face sticking its tongue out. When the temple is flipped upside down, that statue very strongly resembles... Majora's Mask.

It's definitely one of the creepiest things in the game. It has two enormous horns above its eyes, horns on the sides of its face, and is shaped like a heart, although the bottom is missing. Part of the Stone Tower emblem can be seen at the bottom, so I think it's possible that part of the structure broke off. I actually got the cutscene about the portal to the boss's lair to trigger in the Stone Tower in my current file, and the cut scene made it look like that disturbing statue was the one speaking to Link. And, the door above that statue leads directly to Twinmold/Majora's lair, where Majora's Mask's image is emblazoned on all the towers in a style that is distinctly different than the one of the mask emblem that appears on all the blocks in the game.

that's very interesting theory you came up with there, I'll have to play MM to look at all the things that you described. This theory is one of the most interesting ones I've seen in a while and I applaud the research that you did on it.

Originally Posted by Hylian Dan

When the temple is flipped upside down, that statue very strongly resembles... Majora's Mask.

Was this what you were talking about by any chance? I outlined the part that resembled majora's mask :S

Yeah, that's it. One of the bottom horns is broken in addition to the missing part of the emblem (the spider-like design on the surrounding walls), so it's likely there was originally more to that figure.

Another thing I didn't bring up before: when you go to that room when the temple is right-side up, a small swirling vortex is clearly visible in the sky. I think it looks slightly different in the N64 and GCN versions. It's probably related to the warp to the desert universe, but of course that's only accesible when the universe is flipped. That's what I was referring to when I speculated that the architects were trying to reach a portal to the heavens, but I had forgotten to check again for it until now.

Hylain Dan, I am now placing a restraining order between you and any-and-all theories you might come up with in the future.

'Cuz you're scarin' all hell outta me!

Amazing theory. Seems to fit everything. And about the music, you're right, ther is the somber one (right-side up) and the eerie one (upside-down) (that one has the srings that go up and down in it... just makes it seem otherworldly. (by the way, the Stone Tower Temple's theme is my favorite in the entire game).

And about the giants thing, I think you have a little less base in fact there, but it still is plausable. However, Kaepora Gaebora refering to them as "Guardian Deities" Make it seem more like they were Gods to begin with:
1. a god or goddess.
2. divine character or nature, esp. that of the Supreme Being; divinity.
3. the estate or rank of a god
4. a person or thing revered as a god or goddess
5. the Deity, God; Supreme Being.
the only one that would work with that is the fourth definition.

I think your theory on the Temple itself is extremely well thought out and very intruiging, and very possible. However, I believe that your venture into the Giant's role is more in the nature of speculation than that of a plausable theory.

Originally Posted by Link-herooftime

Hylain Dan, I am now placing a restraining order between you and any-and-all theories you might come up with in the future.

'Cuz you're scarin' all hell outta me!

Majora's Mask is the darkest Zelda game yet (might change with TP), so delving into the inner workings of that game is bound to get creepy. That doesn't mean we should stay out. Maybe a little warning of some kind for the weaker of heart.

Originally Posted by Daphnes

Majora's Mask is the darkest Zelda game yet (might change with TP), so delving into the inner workings of that game is bound to get creepy. That doesn't mean we should stay out. Maybe a little warning of some kind for the weaker of heart.

I could have used some sort of warning or restraining order before I started playing again this afternoon. This time I figured out that it was possible to jump onto those horrible pillars when the Stone Tower is inverted. It was so freaking disturbing. I don't recommend trying it since - blech! There's absolutely no way Nintendo wasn't aware of what they resembled.

Also, Nintendo made a slight mistake with the Stone Tower. When inverted, the exterior of the temple is mirrored but the interior isn't.

Originally Posted by Obsequious Eye

And about the giants thing, I think you have a little less base in fact there, but it still is plausable. However, Kaepora Gaebora refering to them as "Guardian Deities" Make it seem more like they were Gods to begin with:
1. a god or goddess.
2. divine character or nature, esp. that of the Supreme Being; divinity.
3. the estate or rank of a god
4. a person or thing revered as a god or goddess
5. the Deity, God; Supreme Being.
the only one that would work with that is the fourth definition.

Time to consult a Majora's Mask text dump! (It's not entirely necessary, but these quotes are convenient to have ready.)

Originally Posted by Kaepora Gaebora

Ho-ho-ho-ho-hoot! This is a rare sight. You are a fairy child, correct? What business might you have in this poisoned swamp?
If you dare not venture further, I shall pass no judgment. It is better that you hurry back to town.
This swamp you are in has lost its guardian deity. But it was destined to fade anyway. Hoo-hoot... And that destiny is not solely limited to this swamp...
If you have the courage and determination to proceed in the face of destiny, then I shall teach you something useful.
Before coming here, had you not seen any of the stone statues that bear close resemblance to me?
I have placed those throughout the land to aid the one with the power to change the destiny of this land... Wherever he may appear.

Originally Posted by Tatl

W-What exactly are all of you?
"Guardians." Guardians?
So...You're protective gods? That's why you're in the temples... But...why are the protective gods...?
No, wait! Are you listening to me? Hey! Wait...

Originally Posted by The Carnival of Time

For ages, people have worn masks resembling the giants who are the gods of the four worlds. Now, it has become a custom for each person to bring a hand made mask to the Carnival of Time. It is said that if a couple united on the day of the festival and dedicated a mask as a sign of their union, it would bring luck. The centerpiece of the carnival is the clock tower, and on the eve of all the festivities, the doors to its roof are opened...From atop the clock tower roof, a ceremony to call the gods is held and an ancient song is sung. All of these festivities for the Carnival of Time are held so that we may ask the gods for a rich harvest in the year to come!

Originally Posted by The Four Giants

This tale's from long ago when all the people weren't separated into four worlds like they are now. In those times all the people lived together, and the four giants lived among them. On the day of the festival that celebrates the harvest, the giants spoke to the people..."We have chosen to guard the people while we sleep..." "100 steps north, 100 steps south, 100 steps east, 100 steps west." "If you have need, call us in a loud voice by declaring something such as, 'The mountain blizzard has trapped us.'" "Or 'The ocean is about to swallow us.' Your cries shall carry to us..." Now then... There was one who was shocked and saddened by all this. A little imp. The imp was a friend of the giants since before they had created the four worlds. "Why must you leave?" "Why do you not stay?" The childhood friend felt neglected, so he spread his anger across the four worlds. Repeatedly, he wronged all people. Overwhelmed with misfortune, the people sang the song of prayer to the giants who lived in each of the four compass directions. The giants heard their cry and responded with a roar. "Oh, imp. Oh, imp. We are the protectors of the people." "You have caused the people pain. Oh, imp, leave these four worlds! Otherwise, we shall tear you apart!" The imp was frightened and saddened. He had lost his old friends. The imp returned to the heavens, and harmony was restored to the four worlds. And the people rejoiced and they worshiped the giants of the four worlds like gods. And they lived happily... ever after...

The legend said that the Giants created the four worlds of Termina, and their purpose is to protect that land and its people. I think the defninitions of deity that would apply would be the second and third ones given. The Giants were divine beings created by the Goddesses to shape and protect one of the worlds that had been formed. The Giants aren't all-powerful though, because as Tatl was about to point out, somehow they had been trapped within the wicked masks and therefore were unable to protect Termina, until Link, with the aid of the Goddess of Time, freed them. (I'm not sure how the Giants became imprisoned. Was it the work of Majora's Mask and the Skull Kid?)

And the people rejoiced and they worshiped the giants of the four worlds like gods. And they lived happily... ever after...

I think this line is extremely important. It seems like a happy fairy tale ending, but it's not; it's darkly ironic. The modern Terminians are the descendents of those people, and they are about to be crushed beneath the moon. So they were not going to live happily ever after, and this fairy tale is not as cheerful as it seems on the surface. The "..."s in the last line seem to hint at that irony. I think the preceding line describes the mistake the people made.

"The Four Giants" story makes it clear that the ancient people chose to worship the Giants as gods, and the Stone Tower makes it pretty clear that the anciect Terminians rejected the Goddesses. The four phallic pillars atop the Stone Tower hint that it was the people's love of the four male Giants that motivated them to reject the superior female deities.

Off-topic: I noticed a few interesting things while glancing through all the text:

Originally Posted by ?

There's no time left. Hurry! We have to hide...

Only a little more than two days left...Oh, Goddess of Time, please save me...

Only a little more than one day left...Oh, Goddess of Time, please save me...

Only a little time left... Oh, Goddess of Time, please save me...

Interesting. I think the guy who comes to the Ocean Spider House said this. Hmm.

The game also has some text that is impossible to access in the game. The Gossip Stones on the moon provide hints as to where the masks the you haven't found are, and when you get those masks the text changes. There were hints written for finding the Mask of Truth, the Captain's Hat, the Garo's Mask, and the Gibdo's Mask. Okay...

Also, Sharp will respond if you play the Song of Healing to him. I never knew that.

Originally Posted by Dampe

I'm not going to give up. I'll keep
asking you until you say yes.

That's how I courted my current
wife, you know.

Originally Posted by Hylian Dan

I could have used some sort of warning or restraining order before I started playing again this afternoon. This time I figured out that it was possible to jump onto those horrible pillars when the Stone Tower is inverted. It was so freaking disturbing. I don't recommend trying it since - blech! There's absolutely no way Nintendo wasn't aware of what they resembled.

Hmm, I'm trying to do that right now but I can't seem to get it... So, how do you do it? You saying it's very disturbing makes me more curious.

I told you guys.

Besides, I was only joking...

Originally Posted by Surio

Hmm, I'm trying to do that right now but I can't seem to get it... So, how do you do it? You saying it's very disturbing makes me more curious.

It's disturbing because it just seems wrong. The trick to getting to them is...
Jump onto the eyelid of the temple entrance. From there, do a rolling jump and then use the Blast Mask in midair to propell yourself further.