Stone Tower of Babel: Why Termina was Doomed

The Mirror Shield face reminds me of Link screaming when he puts on a transformation mask. That tormented expression might be alluding to the loneliness and agony of hiding your true face behind a mask. That's the explanation I'm most comfortable with; it ties into the central storyline, and I think it's a fitting explanation for why that expression is so piercing/poignant/unsettling (can't think of the perfect word for it).

The expressions of the Stone Tower faces seem to be mostly sexual. Maybe the builders were alluding to the Giants raping the goddesses, as an expression of dominance and hinting at their plan to use the Giant's mask to destroy the goddesses.

So, what is the significance of the Moon's face? Consider how at the end of the game, the Moon opens its mouth and begins consuming Termina.

Originally Posted by Laughing_corpse

This may not be relevant, but every boss mask has two spikes, (with the possible exception of Odalwa, I can't seem to find two distinct spikes on his mask like the other three), this could be linked to the spikes on Majora' Mask itself.
This then leads to the thought that the four Boss masks are split parts of Majora's essence, which were intended to corrupt the giants.
If you now consider that, going by your theory, the Goddesses unleashed Majora's Mask upon Termina to spite the builders of the Stone Tower, I think it's very interesting that Majora's mask eventually ended up imprisoning the four giants, the giants which the men who built the Stone Tower believed were the true Gods.

That's a neat theory. The boss masks are an interesting subject, but there's so little evidence about them, it seems.

Do you think the Godesses had control over Majora's mask?

Majora's Mask was pure evil. Since it is the complete opposite of the goddesses, it is logical that the mask was found because the Terminians turned away from the goddesses.
The goddesses didn't control the demon, but I think they unleashed it as a sign of their judgment of Termina.


Edit:
I found this discussion about the vortex above the tower, and whether it might be a glitch. There are several screenshots. I haven't finished reading it.

http://www.gamespot.com/n64/adventur...=197770&page=0

Edit 2:
Cool youtube video about the portal:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uwc-xiVOuuM

And, the people at that forum found this thread.

The creation of the Giant's mask could have prompted the Godesses to unleash Majora's Mask. Maybe they felt threatened by it, and it was at this time that they flipped the tower which would lead the Stone Tower builders to Majora's Mask.
It's ironic, instead of the men invading the heavens with the giant's mask and destroying the Godesses, Majora's mask ultimately invades Termina and imprisons the Giants.
Link then eventually finds the Giant's mask and uses it in a similar way to it's original intention: he 'invades' Majora's realm/Terminian hell and destroys Twinmold.

Where do you think Link goes when he frees the giants? I.e. Where he is taught the Oath to Order.
Is it the Giant's realm?

I'd also like to point out how radically different the Stone Towers look on the map than the ones in the game.


It's not important, but maybe this was the original design. If so, then I'd persume the player would have to climb the towers starting at the smallest and working up. I say this because it's the only place I've seen where the towers are referred to in the plural, hinting that the central tower wasn't the only significant one.
The Central tower on the map is not enclosed as in the game...imagine the views!

Originally Posted by Hylian Dan

The Mirror Shield face reminds me of Link screaming when he puts on a transformation mask. That tormented expression might be alluding to the loneliness and agony of hiding your true face behind a mask. That's the explanation I'm most comfortable with; it ties into the central storyline, and I think it's a fitting explanation for why that expression is so piercing/poignant/unsettling (can't think of the perfect word for it).

The expressions of the Stone Tower faces seem to be mostly sexual. Maybe the builders were alluding to the Giants raping the goddesses, as an expression of dominance and hinting at their plan to use the Giant's mask to destroy the goddesses.

Actually, I was about to say that the Mirror Shield's face reminds me of the Stone Tower faces.

That portal theory was amazing and brilliant! Dan, your theory is still amazing. And I'm always here for snapshots of MM if you need me.

Originally Posted by Hylian Dan

The Mirror Shield face reminds me of Link screaming when he puts on a transformation mask. That tormented expression might be alluding to the loneliness and agony of hiding your true face behind a mask. That's the explanation I'm most comfortable with; it ties into the central storyline, and I think it's a fitting explanation for why that expression is so piercing/poignant/unsettling (can't think of the perfect word for it).

Well, everything seems to be about hiding your true face/secrets etc. The mirror shield bugs me even more now.... So what your saying is that the mirror shield somehow is related to the tranformation masks? As far as i concern, the entire shield could be a damned mask! It seems to have most of the attributes of a "normal" transformation mask, except from that you don´t wear it. So you don´t transform. (This is probaly irrelevant, but I thought I might as well post it.)

The expressions of the Stone Tower faces seem to be mostly sexual. Maybe the builders were alluding to the Giants raping the goddesses, as an expression of dominance and hinting at their plan to use the Giant's mask to destroy the goddesses.

It wouldn´t surprise me. Concidering what they´ve done this far to insult the godesses, that is just small business. But notice that tribes that used sex in such ways existed long time ago. Kinda like the very old celts and the nordic gods (I don´t know the proper english word for them, but in swedish we call them "asar".) And even older tribes. That tower is old! Really, really old!

So, what is the significance of the Moon's face? Consider how at the end of the game, the Moon opens its mouth and begins consuming Termina.

Well, that can be.... the godesses sucking revenge? ^^ I seriously don´t know why they made such a misunderstandable (word?) destruction scene. But it´s always fun to misunderstand the lines in MM!

Originally Posted by Laughing_corpse

The creation of the Giant's mask could have prompted the Godesses to unleash Majora's Mask. Maybe they felt threatened by it, and it was at this time that they flipped the tower which would lead the Stone Tower builders to Majora's Mask.

I doubt they felt threatened by it, but perhaps they didn´t like the thought of the Terminians thinking that they could slay the godesses.

Where do you think Link goes when he frees the giants? I.e. Where he is taught the Oath to Order.
Is it the Giant's realm?

I can only direct you to a previoous post by me in this thread where I speculate in the possibility of several heavens. (Like Majora and the godesses would share.Not!)

I'd also like to point out how radically different the Stone Towers look on the map than the ones in the game.

It's not important, but maybe this was the original design. If so, then I'd persume the player would have to climb the towers starting at the smallest and working up. I say this because it's the only place I've seen where the towers are referred to in the plural, hinting that the central tower wasn't the only significant one.
The Central tower on the map is not enclosed as in the game...imagine the views!

It´s probaly and old version you´ve uploaded, but I think that even on the version that was used the towers didn´t look a bit like they really do. Also notice how clocktown look. And on the version they used, there was no place called "Goron Shrine" and it says Stone towers. Plural.

It´s probaly and old version you´ve uploaded, but I think that even on the version that was used the towers didn´t look a bit like they really do. Also notice how clocktown look. And on the version they used, there was no place called "Goron Shrine" and it says Stone towers. Plural.

No, I'm 99% certain this is the map in the game. The only places marked on the game map are the locations of the warp points, so that's why Goron Shrine isn't marked.

Originally Posted by PurachinaIto

Well, everything seems to be about hiding your true face/secrets etc. The mirror shield bugs me even more now.... So what your saying is that the mirror shield somehow is related to the tranformation masks? As far as i concern, the entire shield could be a damned mask! It seems to have most of the attributes of a "normal" transformation mask, except from that you don´t wear it. So you don´t transform. (This is probaly irrelevant, but I thought I might as well post it.)

I didn't mean it has any literal connection to the transformation masks. I think the face's agonized expression is purely symbolic, another way of expressing the thematic content of the story. Since Link makes the same expression when he puts on a mask, I think the shield face represents the true face of a person who wears a "mask".

I'll use Skull Kid as an example. His words and actions made him appear to the world to be cold and heartless, but he was really going through terrible emotional pain. Instead of expressing that pain, he hid it behind an emotionless mask so that he would appear strong on the outside. However, his pain couldn't be healed if no one could see it. As a result, his soul became more and more tormented as he masked it, and as I see it the Mirror Shield face represents that sort of tormented soul. It doesn't represent any actual person, just an abstract idea.

A lot of the elements in MM probably represent abstract themes and ideas, which is why it's so difficult to understand so many things from a literal standpoint. The imagery and dialogue from the finale, in particular, probably have much more symbolic meaning than literal meaning. A beautiful tree at the center of an empty field; the Clock Tower at the center of Termina, counting down to the end of the world; a child sitting alone, wearing Majora's Mask, while other children play; the poignant questions the children ask after playing hide-and-seek; Termina being consumed by the terrifying face of the moon; Link and Tatl's choice to enter the abyss inside the moon; Majora's Mask's transformation into a demon; the heart-like shape of the mask and the heartbeat that you hear during these transformations...

I don't have explanations for what all of these things might mean, but I'm interested in looking for the possible meanings behind them.

Excellent theory, Hylian Dan. I love it. 100%. It makes perfect sense, and it gives MM a new Biblical feel. Very nice.
I've always thought that LoZ games were somewhat spiritual and now I'm confident they are! Being a Christian, it's quite nice to have games that pay homage to the stories you hold dear. Very nice theory, by far the most interesting and fun theory I've ever heard. Keep it up.

Originally Posted by Hylian Dan

I didn't mean it has any literal connection to the transformation masks. I think the face's agonized expression is purely symbolic, another way of expressing the thematic content of the story. Since Link makes the same expression when he puts on a mask, I think the shield face represents the true face of a person who wears a "mask".

Oh, well now that you explained it, it sounds quite plausible. But then someone must have watched another one transform using a mask. Because symbolic or not, it is a painting/picture/carving made by someone. And who might that be? Perhaps the person holding Majoras mask before. Or perhaps it is our beloved Salesman himself. (He still scares me.) The shield is old (I think) so it must have been made a long time ago. Perhaps it was made approximately at the same time that the Garos found Majoras mask?

(note; It seems to be only a few times they´re speaking of. Now, when Majora was found, when Ikana fell and so on.)

The person wearing Majoras mask must have made quite the face when he put it on. But have anyone really worn the mask before the skullkid/after the sealing? Every time someone puts it on (who can´t control it. Otherwise the world would have been destroyed a couple of times already.) the mask seems to try to destroy the world and achieve demon form.

Surely there are many transformation masks out there. But hey! You find the shield in the well. Guarded by gibdos. Gibdos are cursed humans. And when you heal one, you get a mask. So if someone were researching transformations and masks.... they might come to the well in Ikana because of the gibdos. And just like Pamelas father they got cursed. Who knows, the one that made the shield might still be down there... Poor thing...

I love you. I seriously do. You have brought new meaning to this game. It all makes sense to me now and I feel some closure now for this game. I'm used to feeling empty after a Zelda game because I don't know why everything happened and what's going to happen next. Now, I feel better.

It all makes perfect and amazing sense.

You guys not only reminded me of Majora's Mask, you let me realize how much was hidden deep in the setting.

Well interesting theory but.. I think that Majora's Mask and the Skull Kid were causing the Moon to fall, right?

Danzaiver, Majora's Mask was just using the powerless Skull Kid as a pawn. Majora's Mask had basically full control over Skull Kid since he put the mask on.
In conclusion, Majora's Mask attempted to crush Termina with the moon.

Originally Posted by Eros

Danzaiver, Majora's Mask was just using the powerless Skull Kid as a pawn. Majora's Mask had basically full control over Skull Kid since he put the mask on.
In conclusion, Majora's Mask attempted to crush Termina with the moon.

And to further shina a light....
Majora wanted to destroy/consume Termina because she is evil and wicked. And the godesses let her because they were pissed of at the Terminians (or mostly the Ikanians) because they worshiped their giants as gods. And on top off that, the Ikanians then build the Stonetower to further insult the godesses. (Actually, they did alot more than simply insult them... further details is in this thread...) So they don´t do much to stop the newly awakend Majora when she`s mind controlling the skullkid. But then Link comes and start to make people happy, the godesses see that Termina isn´t completly corrupted and decides to aid Link in his final battle by granting him the FD.

I think I summed up most of the plot here, didn´t I? And I could go on forever about the Salesman....but thats another story.... Hylian Dan is better with words than I am!

Originally Posted by Hylian Dan

At the top of the Stone Tower, there is a statue of a hand that points to the sky. Every time I looked at it I wondered why it was there. When I was playing that part of the game last night, I looked at the architecture at the entrance to the temple and I noticed that the tower next to the hand looked very phallic... then I understood.

And now, I think I've solved a large part of the mystery of Majora's Mask.

The Stone Tower is the Terminian equivalent of the Tower of Babel. The story of the Tower of Babel tells of mankind's attempt to defy God by building a tower that would reach the heavens. Because this was an act of wickedness, God thwarted their plans by making every man speak a different language. Unable to communicate, the men could not continue building the tower.

How does this apply to the Stone Tower? Many people here have mentioned that the Triforce can be seen on the statues leading to Ikana and on the blocks Link crosses to reach the top of the Tower. Nintendo did not put the Triforce there accidentally, or as an Easter egg. The Triforce is placed on the end of the tongue of the statue, and the statue uses its tongue to cover its crotch. Clearly the architects of those obscene statues were aware of the Triforce's existence and were mocking the three goddesses.

The hand at the top of the Stone Tower is pointing at the goddesses, and the phallic tower next to it is saying "Screw you." The Stone Tower itself resembles a giant phallus, sticking out of the earth and pointing towards the heavens.

The ancient ones who built the Stone Tower were blaspheming the goddesses of the Triforce. Their plan seems to have been to open a portal in the sky that would lead them to heaven. But the goddesses would not allow this to happen, and they would not let this evil go unpunished. So they flipped the universe upside down.

The architects opened the portal, but because everything had been reversed it led them to hell. And in hell there was a being that had been sealed away during a previous age, a being that had attempted to destroy the world. The architects found the mask of the demon and brought it with them. And so the goddesses punished the builders of the Stone Tower by releasing Majora into their world. That world was then called Termina because it was doomed to end. The men who had found the mask honored it by placing symbols of it in all the temples, as well as in the realm where they had found it (Twinmold's lair?).

Ages later, the Skull Kid stole the mask and the demon finally had a weak host it could use as a puppet. As Majora gained strength, it summoned the moon to come crashing into Termina, as it was the fate of that world to be destroyed. But then a child came into that doomed world, a child who was a member of the race that had been blessed by the goddesses, a child who had carried a piece of the sacred Triforce. That child was Link, and in three days he conquered the devil and saved the world. It should be noted that Link had entered a portal in the sky as he did this; was that the realm the ancient ones had tried to reach? As the moon was cast back into the heavens, the goddesses left behind a rainbow as a promise that they would not again seek to destroy Termina, as God had left a rainbow in the sky as a covenant with Noah after flooding the world.

Interestingly enough, though the goddesses spared Termina, they did send a flood to wipe out Hyrule.

Another thing I want to mention: In the Stone Tower Temple Link found the Giant's Mask, which was a sort of tranformation mask. Each transformation mask contained a being's essence. Was there, at one point, a fifth Giant? Were there two Giants in the East, and was one of them sealed away? The Giant's Mask closely resembles the mask of the Garo Master. Perhaps one Giant was the patriarch of the Garos and the other the patriarch of the Ikanans, and the ancient conflict was the source of the tensions that led to the war that destroyed Ikana.

Some of the credit for these theories goes to this thread at IGN, although my theories are fairly different. I found that thread with a google search; so far I've only read the first post.

So, what do you think?


Edit: This thread has gotten pretty long, so I'm going to try to start summarizing a few of the topics discussed here for those who don't have time to read the whole thing.

- There is a major piece of evidence for this theory in the first room of the Stone Tower Temple. At first the central statue seems to depict a distorted face sticking out its tongue, but notice what it resembles when the tower is inverted:





It is a statue of Majora's Mask. The bottom part broke off. If you look at it in the game, an emblem was painted on the bottom of the statue, but part of it is missing, indicating that the statue was originally heart-shaped.

Dude, all of this stuff is freacking alswome. Dude rock on. Theorist (i spelled it wrong, I think) all the way man. I'm with you.

Thanks to you theory I have started to replay Majora's Mask because I want to check out Stone Tower for myself. You rock. You got me thinking much more about my favorite Zelda game.

I read a few things and thought, "I wish they would have posted a picture with this." So I took the pictures myself, and here they are:


Top of Stone Tower:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0608.jpg
Notice the four phallic towers and the hand pointing up.


Bottom of Floating Rock:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0786.jpg
Notice the (whatever it is) and its tongue, and the triforce underneath (which is what you see most prominently once you flip the tower (see next picture))


Pillars and (whatever they are) Blocks Upside-down:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0893.jpg
Notice the triforce sitting on the tongue.


Pillar and Pointing Hand Upside-down:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0803.jpg



Face Entrance, Pillar, and (whatever they are) Blocks Upside-down:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0842.jpg
A sort of side-view of the (whatever they are) Blocks.


Mask Statue Resembling Majora's Mask (inside, upside-down):
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0968.jpg
A really crappy view of the statue. I tried taking pictures from the side, and from the entrance, but there was always something in the way, so I took the picture from above. The view is clear, but you can't see the complete statue because of the angle.


Portal in the Sky (inside, right-side-up):
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0994.jpg
I'm still not sure about this. It's not the portal to Twinmold's desert, because that's further back in the temple. I don't think it's a programming mistake, either.


I didn't have much plot to add, just pictures. They will hopefully help someone who is lost or who temporarily doesn't have access to MM.

If you want a picture of something, let me know, and I'll try to do it.

EDIT: I just noticed something. Someone said something about the triforces on the (whatever they are) blocks pointing into the temple and ultimately into the Twinmold portal. However, looking up from underneath when the world is right-side-up, the triforces actually point away. What do you think?

This whole thing is absolutely fascinating... I have wondered what that Portal thing is for as well... does anyone know?

I've been looking around for more clues. Found a couple things.

This is the upside-down triforce someone mentioned earlier that you see on the ground right after you get turned into a deku scrub.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0001.jpg


Some old man's face on the door from that room.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0014.jpg


Compass symbol on the floor, a room or two after that.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0017.jpg


Pillar engraving inside clock tower. Looks kind of like some Ikana pillars.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0052.jpg


Mural on the wall inside clock tower. A person/creature with a face where it's supposed to be, as well as a second face there their torso should be. Perhaps it's a painting or tattoo of eyes and mouth on their belly?
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0058.jpg


Eastern exit of clock town. This exit is the only one that resembles a head/face. The south one is made of wood, the west one has a seashell, and the north one looks like ice blocks.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0139.jpg


A small mystery. (very small.) It looks like there are triangles pointing somewhere on the top of the wooden pillars in north clock town. Probably nothing.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0190.jpg


The door to clock tower. (looks the same on the inside.) The two pair of pennants running above are the same two symbols used in north and west clock town. (why north and west?) For curiosity's sake, I'll put links to them below.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0166.jpg

North symbol:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0093.jpg
West symbol:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0181.jpg
South symbol:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0172.jpg
East symbol:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0296.jpg


For comparison's sake, here are the pennant flags running all around clock town.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0068.jpg
Here are the pennant flags in woodfall.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0216.jpg
I see a striking similarity. How do decorations from clock town make it all the way throught the poisoned swamp and up a waterfall?


Lastly, just to stir up a little interest, I have no idea whether this picture is how it originally appeared, or if my emulator is being weird. Open with caution.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/snap0179.jpg
It looks like a cross is engraved on the side of the moon's tear. Someone said the moon's tear might represent the Goddesses' regret at having to deal such a cruel fate to Termina. Does this relate to the cross?...

Take a look at these if you want, and let me know what you think.

P.S. I realized once I posted the other pictures that they are quite large, and I don't want some poor hapless soul with dial-up (no offense) to not be able to see the page, so I just put the link there.

why would a cross have anything to do with anything in Zelda?
perhaps it is merely seeing what you want to see?
it is just a design, not a symbol
I wonder why this isn't in the fanfic section or something.

and serious graphic glitch on the tear...
what is up with that...