End of Phantom Hourglass Discussion.

Do not read further if you have not beaten Phantom Hourglass. I will only put the following part with spoiler tags but after that none are needed.

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I personally thought the ending had many openings to another possible Cel-shaded Zelda game. First it is revealed that you were in a different world the whole time. Then, Tetras crew believes that only 10 minutes have passed and keep on insisting that the experiences in the game were just a bad dream.

The most interesting part to me was that Link had the Phantom Hourglass even though it had no reason to exist any more now that the Ocean King was freed and he did not have the Phantom Sword and that Link could see Lineback's ship. I wonder if in the next game (if they make one) will answer why

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Spoiler (Highlight to read):

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I personally think that the Ocean King had his own world of he's, and he only went to the Hylian World to attempt to stop Bellum.

As for the 10 minutes thing, I think he placed Link, Tetra, ans Lineback, backwards in time.

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Okay, I'm sorry, but if you're looking in a thread called "the ending", you're *looking* for spoilers.

I guess the time travel thing *is* possible. Problem is, it's pretty hard to tell which world is which. If Linebeck was originally from another dimension, it'd be kinda cruel to dump him in another world without permission. That's the biggest argument to be made for time travel in this case... Or heck, maybe the pirates were under some sort of spell by the Ghost Ship and defeating it "let them out"?

The weird thing is, rewatching the beginning and ending, I get the feeling the pirates were following the ghost ship the entire time. They weren't fussed about Zelda's supposed dissappearance or anything.

At first I was ready to dismiss the whole PH game world as another Termina, but when I rewatched the beginning, they mention the Ocean King... So the local lore is there too, as if they've already been around the neighborhood at least once.

I guess it's safe to assume that they were temporarily transported to another realm for the last battle. But it truely is very confusing.

If I had to be honest with myself, I'd really hope the other world was *not* another Termina-type-place. It sounds stupid, but as I progressed in the game, I was really excited to "discover" what happened to the Gorons. (Yeah, I know they're traders in Wind Waker, but I doubt all of them are...) My first thought at the end was "Don't tell me that wasn't real! "

I rather think they where from the beginning in the Ocean King's world, if you see it from Linebeck's point of view. However the evidence that I have are not without doubt.

First he has been hunting after the Ghost ship. Secondly He needed the sea charts so he didn't know the region.Third at the ending he is seen in the normal world going his own way.

this concludes to me that he was from the normal world until at one point of time he encountered the ghost ship and went into the OK's world.

Also don't forget the Ghost ship originally belongs in the OK's world, not the normal one.

the only doubt I have is because of Jolene and her sister. the only explanation that they would be there is that the chased after Linebeck while he was chasing the ghost ship and went into the OK's world. the only problem is why would Jolene's sister come with her if she is dressing up as a pirate?

I think that the ocean king, since he has unlimited powers, brought linebeck, tetra, and link to his world so link would have motivation for helping him, and so that linebeck would have motivation for lending link his boat. I'm just assuming that linebeck is from the main world. Although... that doesn't explain why he knows that female pirate... hmmm

Thinking about it, I'd say that, that small section of ocean was still part of the Great Sea, and not necessarily litterally "another world", even though that is what is said.

At the beginning the pirate crew chased the Ghost Ship. Boom, some fog, and Tetra and Link cross the threshold. Link passes out, Tetra is missing, the quest begins. I'd say that that entire section of sea was probably caught in some kind of time warp, or at least warped them and Linebeck to another place on the Great Sea (possibly with time-warping consequences).

Linebeck is obviously (o.k. maybe not) from the Great Sea, and the Ocean King even mentions Link helping to save it. I wonder though, could he have been referring to Link's previous adventure? If this small area was still part of the Great Sea, then Jolene makes perfect sense, as she is just sailing the sea looking for Linebeck.

Think of stepping through the fog, onto the Ship as a wormhole of sorts. This instantly took them to another place, at the exact same time. Link saves the Ocean King, who then places them back through the wormhole (meanwhile fixing some ships), and OMG it's only been ten minutes. This could be a potential explanation as to why the Phantom Hourglass has no sand in it when Link looks at it, but I'm just willing to go with, it has served it's purpose to the Ocean King took the sand. I think that small patch of ocean was just the Ocean Kings domain, and that was "his world" so to speak. By saving the Ocean King, Link saved the Great Sea once again.

Now, if you want to go with them pulling another Link's Awakening, then Linebeck probably wouldn't mind being dropped in a world that's practically the same as his. His life was on the sea anyway. It would be nothing new. I'm not so willing to go with it being as simple as "just another world", it seems too out of place. Too tacked on.

Actually it probably was tacked on at the end to add to the mystery, oooooh.

Just adding in my 2 cents.

I think the Ocean King merely turned whatever happened between Link, Tetra & Linebeck, into nothing but a memory. The adventure was no doubt longer than 10 minutes long, and I'm sure the world they were in wasn't really a dream (since Link had the hourglass with him still).

So yeh, just to ensure peace and calm had remained within the lands, I think the Ocean King brought Link, Tetra & Linebeck to their proper time & places, and turned the whole adventure into a memory.

But as I read the theory above this one... that actually makes more sense to me.

Hmm... maybe linebeck was rewarded for his semi-unselfishness and was set into a greater sea so he could find more treasure?

SPOILERS!!!-SPOILERS!!!-SPOILERS!!!

My take on this. The Ocean King, while indeed being the protector of that section of the Great Sea, is from, and lives, in another dimension. Bellum is also from this dimension, and the both of them have the power to bring others to and from the two. The Ghost Ship, being a manifestation of Bellum's power, acts as a portal. While on the ship, you are in this dimension. Bellum had origionaly stollen the Ocean King's life force while in the other Dimension, but to get more life force, he created the Ghost Ship, and went to the Great Sea, taking with him the weak Ocean King. He then took up residence in the Temple of the Ocean King. At the end, after Bellum is defeated, everyone is on the Ghost Ship (in the other dimension), and the Ocean King comes up. The spirits are going to truely head into the other Dimension, along with the Ocean King. This would explain them being in the 'other world', while the spirits still need to go there. For if they just left the ship, they would end up back in the Great Sea. Once they are about to leave, the Ocean King manipulates the Ghost Ship, repairing it, and sending Link, Tetra, and Linebeck back to the Great Sea. He used up the Sand of Hours to send them back to when it all started, and, with the Sands gone, the Phantom Sword is turned back into an empty Phantom Hourglass.

Phew, there you go. Makes sence, does it not?

That does make sense. You have it exactly how i thought it to be. (I don't know why I'm even posting here. I haven't beaten the game yet.)

Originally Posted by HelmarocKing

SPOILERS!!!-SPOILERS!!!-SPOILERS!!!

My take on this. The Ocean King, while indeed being the protector of that section of the Great Sea, is from, and lives, in another dimension. Bellum is also from this dimension, and the both of them have the power to bring others to and from the two. The Ghost Ship, being a manifestation of Bellum's power, acts as a portal. While on the ship, you are in this dimension. Bellum had origionaly stollen the Ocean King's life force while in the other Dimension, but to get more life force, he created the Ghost Ship, and went to the Great Sea, taking with him the weak Ocean King. He then took up residence in the Temple of the Ocean King. At the end, after Bellum is defeated, everyone is on the Ghost Ship (in the other dimension), and the Ocean King comes up. The spirits are going to truely head into the other Dimension, along with the Ocean King. This would explain them being in the 'other world', while the spirits still need to go there. For if they just left the ship, they would end up back in the Great Sea. Once they are about to leave, the Ocean King manipulates the Ghost Ship, repairing it, and sending Link, Tetra, and Linebeck back to the Great Sea. He used up the Sand of Hours to send them back to when it all started, and, with the Sands gone, the Phantom Sword is turned back into an empty Phantom Hourglass.

Phew, there you go. Makes sence, does it not?

That actually makes the most sense. And while they were in that other dimesion, only 10 minutes had passed in their original world.

Originally Posted by HelmarocKing

SPOILERS!!!-SPOILERS!!!-SPOILERS!!!

My take on this. The Ocean King, while indeed being the protector of that section of the Great Sea, is from, and lives, in another dimension. Bellum is also from this dimension, and the both of them have the power to bring others to and from the two. The Ghost Ship, being a manifestation of Bellum's power, acts as a portal. While on the ship, you are in this dimension. Bellum had origionaly stollen the Ocean King's life force while in the other Dimension, but to get more life force, he created the Ghost Ship, and went to the Great Sea, taking with him the weak Ocean King. He then took up residence in the Temple of the Ocean King. At the end, after Bellum is defeated, everyone is on the Ghost Ship (in the other dimension), and the Ocean King comes up. The spirits are going to truely head into the other Dimension, along with the Ocean King. This would explain them being in the 'other world', while the spirits still need to go there. For if they just left the ship, they would end up back in the Great Sea. Once they are about to leave, the Ocean King manipulates the Ghost Ship, repairing it, and sending Link, Tetra, and Linebeck back to the Great Sea. He used up the Sand of Hours to send them back to when it all started, and, with the Sands gone, the Phantom Sword is turned back into an empty Phantom Hourglass.

Phew, there you go. Makes sence, does it not?

Nice interpretation man. Well thought out.

The biggest clue for the player is the Phantom Hourglass. I don't think its so much as a tangible link to "another" realm, as it was just a piece of evidence that Link, Linebeck, and Tetra really did have an experience. I mean after all, it would make sense that the Ocean King with Ciela's time-controlling powers would just warp them back as if none of the peril ever happened.

Originally Posted by Traffic

Nice interpretation man. Well thought out.

The biggest clue for the player is the Phantom Hourglass. I don't think its so much as a tangible link to "another" realm, as it was just a piece of evidence that Link, Linebeck, and Tetra really did have an experience. I mean after all, it would make sense that the Ocean King with Ciela's time-controlling powers would just warp them back as if none of the peril ever happened.

That's what I'm thinking into.

Should I believe that the Ghost Ship had sent Link & Tetra to an alternate world under Bellum's influence, and then returned to their own world under the Ocean King's power, in which only a mere 10 minutes had passed?

Or should I believe that the world Tetra & Link were in was the same world they've always been in, except that when the Ocean King is restored, he sends Link & Tetra back to a certain time & place, with the revived Ghost Ship under his influence, and leaving nothing but a memory behind for our adventurers, as well as an empty Hourglass.

It surely wasn't a dream. They had experienced an actual journey. The question is...
Was it in another world? -- Or was it left as a memory?

Thanx 4 the spoilers . Considering that it'll be a long time before I play PH (I don't even own a DS yet), it was nice to know how the game ended without actually having to go out and buy a DS plus a copy of this game, and then beat the game.

BTW, I wasn't being sarcastic.

You weren't being sarcastic??? Then again, why would you be. This whole thread was obviously full of spoilers.

Since prior to you reaching the point where the characters even could have been dreaming, you hear/see elements of the "world" they are about to enter (i.e., they talk about the Ocean King and his seas like they are common knowledge), and since the characters who enter this "world" witness elements that must have existed outside of it (Linebeck's old girlfriend, for example), I'm inclined to believe that the "world of the Ocean King" is simply his domain - i.e., the seas he rules.

Which would mean that, at the end of the game, he simply warps you back outside his waters.

And since nothing outside the fact that they wake from unconsciousness at the end of the game suggests they they were actually in a nightmare (and we know that the Ocean King possesses powers of time travel), I'm more inclined to say that appearing only ten minutes after the intro is evidence of time travel, not a nightmare.

The references to nightmares and "worlds", and probably also the Ocean King's true appearance as a flying whale all seem to be jabs at Link's Awakening. These jabs (a DS-shaped island; the "Prince of Red Lions", etc.) appear all over the game.