The Romance Thread IV: The Debate Continues

Dealing with the worse aspect of Lon Lon Ranch~

Living with Malon maight actually be worse than Zelda. LOn Lon ranch is isolated in Hyrule field, whereas Hyrule Castle is in the midst of castle town. Easy access.

I'd kinda think that he could train in the ranch, he'd have to run dangerous errends all over Hyrule and beyond, he'd have a lot of room to ride Epona, and it's a great place to stay until he is needed again as the Hero of (Insert whatever here).

I would think that other than the dangers that happen once in a gazillion years, Hyrule Castle would be a lot of paperworkish type stuff and quite boring dealing with the monarchy and the people like dukes, ect.

That's just my take on the Malon/Zelda debate.

Originally Posted by Spector

I'd kinda think that he could train in the ranch, he'd have to run dangerous errends all over Hyrule and beyond, he'd have a lot of room to ride Epona, and it's a great place to stay until he is needed again as the Hero of (Insert whatever here).

Train against who? He's not going to have the benefit of learning new tactics
and techniques on a peaceful farm. If he went up against the talented knights and commanders of Hyrule's forces it stands to reason he could learn. If there's no-one capable to teach him anything than a previous point is only supported: they need him to do the teaching.

Originally Posted by Spector

I would think that other than the dangers that happen once in a gazillion years, Hyrule Castle would be a lot of paperworkish type stuff and quite boring dealing with the monarchy and the people like dukes, ect.

That's just my take on the Malon/Zelda debate.

We all have one. It keeps the thread going.

As for the dangers and paperwork, I think it depends on how much imagination you can throw into it. Some paperwork and meeting with nobles/foreigners would need to be done, but Link could be a very-hands on monarch if he married Zelda. Visiting his people, training and leading his forces, etc...his role would be what he made it. If he sat around to make every decision himself, he would be guilty of "micro-managing". Let councils, nobles and servants handle the minor things. A leader who was visible to his people and pro-active in being involved with everyday affairs would be hugely popular. Zelda doesn't seem like the type to want to sit hidden in a castle either. They make a wonderful team.

Originally Posted by Craymel

I'm kind of second guessing my whole super secret relationship with Oot adult link now.. Although I think he's cuter then the tp link. He just feels like a ten year old in a seventeen year olds body. He never wants to talk either. When ever I try he just keeps yelling at me loudly and not actually speaking any form of language. I'm sure intensive couples therapy can solve all our problems though.

Its as simple as this. In Links child like state of mind the only romantic interests that are more likely to teach Link the birds and the bees are Malon, Ruto, or Nabooru NOT Zelda and Saria.

Originally Posted by gliderpilotgirl

Zelda in her adult years I can totally see making the rounds of Hyrule, with Link alongside her.

About the convenient relationship thing: you can turn that around too. I don't think Link would choose a convenient relationship with Malon just to live in supposed freedom. She's being used because she's "common" just as much as Zelda is eliminated for being "not-common". There's more to it than that.



Once again: turn it around. Being with Zelda means to me that Link not only chooses the woman who loves him and understands his needs, but he also chooses the well being of the common people of Hyrule."

Link's not simple though: he has larger needs. Like needing to matter and have purpose. Living an existance as a farmer would likely leave him feeling hollow and Malon would not remotely understand it. She's satisfied by it, why shouldn't he be? I wouldn't expect her to fully support him running off for an adventure because she has no desire to do that herself.

Its nice to know that you share the same view as mine in that the LinkxZelda relationship is basically a master (Zelda ) pet (Link) couple but more likely a little less profound in the Child Timeline of course.

The whole Talon turns a whole new leaf is just that and nothing more. It neither supports or denies a LinkxMalon. And obviously you missed the point that this notion of freedom that you speak of is Link putting the benefit of Hyrule above himself than the convenience of living a cozy lifestyle as Zeldas obedient errand boy. WoW What a courageous and just life for the hero (Cough) Sarcasm (Cough) And how do you know Malon won't support Link in being a hero?? More than likely the hints point more that Malon would be very supportive of Link being her knight in shining armor that she has always dreamed about. This whole retarded Zelda shipper theory that Link has to hide his heroic side because Malon would just die if he broke a fingernail is beyond ridiculous. IMO Malon would be the polar opposite and support Link in performing his hero duties. I am sure that once she has her knight in shining armor in Link she would already know WAAAY before hand that her husband/lover would have responsibilities in being a hero in not just protecting her and the ranch but all of Hyrule as well. She is not an oblivious narrrow minded bimbo as some Zelda shippers exagerrate her to be. The LinkxMalon pairing IMO is kind of like the Spiderman romance The common girl supports her lover in being a hero

IN REGARDS TO YOUR MOST RECENT POST
In a possible LinkxZelda in child timeline I feel Link needs to somehow earn the respect of the Hyrule King. Maybe through starting his training the very day Zelda finally reveals the existence of Link to him, in order to prove that this harmless cuddly forest child posseses the TOC. I see the King ordering about 3 or 4 common footsoldiers to severly beatdown Link to a bloody pulp and if he can endure this royal and regal trial by combat and not cry like a little baby then thats solid proof he really has the TOC. Despite horrid screams of agony, Link would take it like a trooper and not cry. Links face would be bloodied and beaten by trials end but Zelda would very predictaby throw her arms around him despite being beaten dirty bloody and bruised. Link with his perfectly blank stare would probably be very happy inside. In other words I begrudgingly support your theory on Links training in combat skills would have to be with intense basic training from the very first day he earns his living in Hyrule Castle. Of course Zelda will always be present in all his trials and errors to kiss the boo boos away.

But good god I hope Malon steals Link away from Zelda, but yet I think that its obvious that the Hyrule Knights will be teaching Link his specialized training, but I still think that Link will be spending a lot of time in LonLon ranch in improving his horseriding skills with Epona and getting good excercice in staying in shape by playing and running around with his beloved friend Malon on that big open field away and free from the very annoying rules and regulations of Hyrule Castle. But as far as Link doing the teaching , its not likely until he hits puberty and gets his growth spurts.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

Its nice to know that you share the same view as mine in that the LinkxZelda relationship is basically a master (Zelda ) pet (Link) couple but more likely a little less profound in the Child Timeline of course.

No, we don't share the same view. It seems that you are implying that Zelda being dominant makes the relationship undesirable.
Their are plenty of happy relationships out there in reality with the woman being dominant, usually because she's paired with a quiet guy who thinks the world of her. There's nothing remotely wrong with this either. Link may fit into this nicely...a quiet and nice guy who is truly taken with this brave, intelligent and beautiful woman who has a special place in her heart just for him.
Also, it seems Zelda is being seen for what she is ( the princess ) rather than who she is. You assume because she's the ruler that Link will automatically be cowed by her. Yet she's not known for a bad temper or being forceful. Instead she's kind, apologetic and compassionate, and empathetic, especially his way. She cares about what he thinks and feels.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

The whole Talon turns a whole new leaf is just that and nothing more. It neither supports or denies a LinkxMalon.

It removes some ( or most ) of Talon's motivation for trying get Link in the first place: they are no longer needing a worker to pick up Talon's slack. I doubt it was an accident that Talon said: "I'd bet you'd make the world's best cowboy! -then- the marriage proposal. And in every subsequent time it's, "You can come work here when you grow up!", rather than "Marry my daughter, please!!"

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

And obviously you missed the point that this notion of freedom that you speak of is Link putting the benefit of Hyrule above himself than the convenience of living a cozy lifestyle as Zeldas obedient errand boy. WoW What a courageous and just life for the hero (Cough) Sarcasm (Cough)

That's right. ( no sarcasm ) Spending a life at the side of Hyrule's ruler helping out is a more courageous and useful lifestyle than milking cows and running off to an adventure now and then. As you and others have pointed out, Link's traditional heroic adventures will be unneeded in Hyrule once it's saved. If he still wants to help, it's going to involve Zelda. Otherwise, he's out of a job in Hyrule.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

And how do you know Malon won't support Link in being a hero?? More than likely the hints point more that Malon would be very supportive of Link being her knight in shining armor that she has always dreamed about. This whole retarded Zelda shipper theory that Link has to hide his heroic side because Malon would just die if he broke a fingernail is beyond ridiculous. IMO Malon would be the polar opposite and support Link in performing his hero duties. I am sure that once she has her knight in shining armor in Link she would aready know WAAAY before hand that her husband/lover would have responsibilities in being a hero in not just protecting her and the ranch but all of Hyrule as well. She is not an oblivious narrrow minded bimbo as some Zelda shippers exagerrate her to
be.

I think that "knight in shining armor" quote was a mere childish fantasy, as she lived a daydreamer's sheltered life behind the ranch's gates. When she grows up she sits there moping when hardship comes...not challenging it fearlessly like Zelda does. Cremia is no different. To portray Malon as extraordinarily strong and brave seems out of character. She's very ordinary, too ordinary to be successfully paired with Link, IMO.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

The LinkxMalon pairing IMO is kind of like the Spiderman romance The common girl supports her lover in being a hero

But there is nothing common about Mary Jane: if you knew her history you'd know she came from a difficult upbringing ( comic as well as the movie ) and that had contributed towards her strength. She's also quite brave and resourceful. I see none of this strength in Malon.
Also, the creators decided to pair Peter with another superhero in the modern re-imagining ( Ultimate Spider-man) because they thought it would be smarter. It met with huge success, yet the relationship only failed because Peter was too in love with MJ to make it work with the new girl. But we don't have any assurance that Link is love with Malon let alone likes her romantically: Ultimate Spider-man's situation would be more like Ilia's memory sabotaging a relationship TP Link might try to start with someone else.

It seems your Talon reference is being the typical Zelda shipper still upset because the player has the option to be with Malon in a ROMANTIC moonlight setting with her sweet singing voice that would surely have Link completely entranced and under her seductive spell. Plus I know you Zelda shippers just hate us Malon shippers referencing the cow in Links house. To bad Zelda doesn't have special access to Links house like Malon does.

Anyway in the Adult Timeline the LinkxZelda at the very best would be a non romantic relationship in which Zelda is forced to treat Link like a special needs child. All I can see is that everytime a royal meeting is about to start, Zelda would have to command Link to stand in a corner in the royal courtyard and stay put until she says otherwise, in which he should be convieniently out of the way until the royal meeting is over. Its either this or have Link actually attend the royal meetings where he would likely be the butt of jokes for his strange appearance with a fairy and a creepy looking gaze. Also his special needs mental condition would more than likely make him out to be this comically bizarre freak show totally out of place in the presence of the Hyrule Court. To me this is a sad and pathetic existence for Link and there is nothing for me to believe that his life in Hyrule Castle would be any different from this.

More likely in the Child Timeline, Link will be more competent in the Hyrule Court due to his previous years of experience in training with the knights and Zelda personally overseeing his education in courtly manners and etiquette. So by the time he comes of age he can actively participate in the Hyrule Court with dignity that would make Zelda proud and maybe the King of Hyrule might take notice of Links progress in growing up in the Hyrule Court. Still I think Link and Zelda working as a team is best suited if Link is the Brawn and Zelda is the Brains. In other words Link has no business doing public speeches EVER. Not even in marriage. But IMO, if he did choose Malon over Zelda, it doesn't mean that he can't still be good friends with Zelda and continue to work as a team as you like to reference, in maintaining stability in Hyrule and keeping its borders and citizens safe.

As for Malon, yeah the similarities with Mary Jane end with the red hair and the similarity that she is a non royal type person who supports her lover in being a hero. But the point you made about Malon not being fearless like Zelda is exactly why I think Link should be with her instead of Zelda in the first place. Zelda doesn't need a man protecting her like Malon does.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

It seems your Talon reference is being the typical Zelda shipper still upset because the player has the option to be with Malon in a ROMANTIC moonlight setting with her sweet singing voice that would surely have Link completely entranced and under her seductive spell. Plus I know you Zelda shippers just hate us Malon shippers referencing the cow in Links house. To bad Zelda doesn't have special access to Links house like Malon does.

Actually, I'm not remotely upset that the option for Malon is there, nor that the player can seek her out if they wish. It means everyone wins: those who want to see Link court Malon can do so when they control him.
Any romance you can imagine in being able to meet Malon at night is more than matched by "the scene in the sky" regardless. And that's not optional...they've gone all out with the music, cinematics and dialogue. With Malon you have to actively be desiring to make romance between her and Link, while the average joe might come to the romantic conclusion on their own with the scene in the sky between Link and Zelda. ( Explaining why the manga and book can get away with making it more romantic. )

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

Still I think Link and Zelda working as a team is best suited if Link is the Brawn and Zelda is the Brains.

Agreed. But she still has to marry someone and Link's a prime candidate. Worse comes to worse he pulls off a Duke of Edinburgh ( Prince Phillip, The Queen's husband ) and follows in her wake. She gets the behind the scenes support she needs from him and whatever expertise had can lend her yet she deals with the negotiating. And Link can and will grow: nobody gives him any credit. He's not going to be the uneducated commoner forever.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

As for Malon, yeah the similarities with Mary Jane end with the red hair and the similarity that she is a non royal type person who supports her lover in being a hero. But the point you made about Malon not being fearless like Zelda is exactly why I think Link should be with her instead of Zelda in the first place. Zelda doesn't need a man protecting her like Malon does.

So strong women don't deserve a protective and caring husband? This strong woman is in charge of an entire kingdom: she could use the support, even if only moral, more than Malon ever will. Zelda no doubt feels fear as well...she has more reason to be afraid than Malon ever will. But the difference is that Zelda overcomes it, where Malon doesn't.
To say that Zelda's strength of character means she shouldn't have Link seems weak to me. There's how many romance novels/movies etc out there where the heroine's courage wins the hero's heart? Zelda/Sheik's strength means he is not alone. Nobody but her likely understand how he feels.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

It seems your Talon reference is being the typical Zelda shipper still upset because the player has the option to be with Malon in a ROMANTIC moonlight setting with her sweet singing voice that would surely have Link completely entranced and under her seductive spell. Plus I know you Zelda shippers just hate us Malon shippers referencing the cow in Links house. To bad Zelda doesn't have special access to Links house like Malon does.

Anyway in the Adult Timeline the LinkxZelda at the very best would be a non romantic relationship in which Zelda is forced to treat Link like a special needs child. All I can see is that everytime a royal meeting is about to start, Zelda would have to command Link to stand in a corner in the royal courtyard and stay put until she says otherwise, in which he should be convieniently out of the way until the royal meeting is over. Its either this or have Link actually attend the royal meetings where he would likely be the butt of jokes for his strange appearance with a fairy and a creepy looking gaze. Also his special needs mental condition would more than likely make him out to be this comically bizarre freak show totally out of place in the presence of the Hyrule Court. To me this is a sad and pathetic existence for Link and there is nothing for me to believe that his life in Hyrule Castle would be any different from this.

More likely in the Child Timeline, Link will be more competent in the Hyrule Court due to his previous years of experience in training with the knights and Zelda personally overseeing his education in courtly manners and etiquette. So by the time he comes of age he can actively participate in the Hyrule Court with dignity that would make Zelda proud and maybe the King of Hyrule might take notice of Links progress in growing up in the Hyrule Court. Still I think Link and Zelda working as a team is best suited if Link is the Brawn and Zelda is the Brains. In other words Link has no business doing public speeches EVER. Not even in marriage. But IMO, if he did choose Malon over Zelda, it doesn't mean that he can't still be good friends with Zelda and continue to work as a team as you like to reference, in maintaining stability in Hyrule and keeping its borders and citizens safe.

As for Malon, yeah the similarities with Mary Jane end with the red hair and the similarity that she is a non royal type person who supports her lover in being a hero. But the point you made about Malon not being fearless like Zelda is exactly why I think Link should be with her instead of Zelda in the first place. Zelda doesn't need a man protecting her like Malon does.

1stly: You're making this rather im-personal, your writing style is less casual... I think you're getting frustrated! Running out of cards to play?

2: Sweet singing voice??? I don't know what quality of sound YOUR speakers cough up! OoT is on the N64! That's about two generations old! It's got the sound quality of... Well... An N64... So your imagination must be rather musically inclined.

3: Would you like someone to break into your house and leave a freaking cow there???? That must stink to high-heaven!

4: The royal meeting likely would not happen in the courtyard. So, if this happens to Link at all, he'd be free to roam the courtyard. Maybe get a nice tan in the sun or nap in the shade. Or even go for a swim! There is water there, you know. Not like anyone is watching.

5: You seem to be under the impression that the King hates Link from the start. Likely, if Zelda made a new friend, he would not go out of his way to make the boy miserable, thus up-setting Zelda. Now, the King would'nt want to make his beloved daughter cry after he had Link "Beaten to a bloody pulp". That mean he's a tyrant, and really not much better than Ganondorf!

As for my supposed "crime" it wasn't nearly as bad as the mod made it seem. Just an example of a flirtatious sentence that would be very out of character for Zelda. In fact, I see no reason to apologise!

Originally Posted by gliderpilotgirl

Actually, I'm not remotely upset that the option for Malon is there, nor that the player can seek her out if they wish. It means everyone wins: those who want to see Link court Malon can do so when they control him.
Any romance you can imagine in being able to meet Malon at night is more than matched by "the scene in the sky" regardless. And that's not optional...they've gone all out with the music, cinematics and dialogue. With Malon you have to actively be desiring to make romance between her and Link, while the average joe might come to the romantic conclusion on their own with the scene in the sky between Link and Zelda. ( Explaining why the manga and book can get away with making it more romantic. )


Agreed. But she still has to marry someone and Link's a prime candidate. Worse comes to worse he pulls off a Duke of Edinburgh ( Prince Phillip, The Queen's husband ) and follows in her wake. She gets the behind the scenes support she needs from him and whatever expertise had can lend her yet she deals with the negotiating. And Link can and will grow: nobody gives him any credit. He's not going to be the uneducated commoner forever.



So strong women don't deserve a protective and caring husband? This strong woman is in charge of an entire kingdom: she could use the support, even if only moral, more than Malon ever will. Zelda no doubt feels fear as well...she has more reason to be afraid than Malon ever will. But the difference is that Zelda overcomes it, where Malon doesn't.
To say that Zelda's strength of character means she shouldn't have Link seems weak to me. There's how many romance novels/movies etc out there where the heroine's courage wins the hero's heart? Zelda/Sheik's strength means he is not alone. Nobody but her likely understand how he feels.

I've never read the manga, but I heard its an idealistically well written storyline for Zelda shippers only. But I still would give it a read if I could. To me a series of books or manga in the child timeline would give more material for romance in a LinkxZelda than the adult timeline IMO. It can start at the end of the OOT adventure where Link passes a test or trial to prove that he has the TOC. Then he goes through his supervised training with the knights where Zelda will always be present to kiss his little boo boos and give him plenty of hugs of reassurance along the way and with her beneficial guidance over the years, Link would make Zelda very proud by the time he came of age. Link of course would be more than thankful that Zelda was always there to provide him with the affectionate love and reassurance that he desperately needed in his formative years to become a hero and BAM they fall in love and both of them conspire to kill the King of Hyrule so they can legally be married. THE END

In the Child Timeline, after the MM adventure, we don't really know what Hyrule's state of condition is but its fun to speculate there would be a need for a hero and a princess to work together to maintain order and stability. In the Adult Timeline it clearly states that there is now peace in Hyrule, therefore Link is no longer needed and has no purpose to his existence except he needs a female to give him the love and affection he desperately craves. As I stated before, it boils down to the love interest more likely to teach him the birds and the bees to overcome his naive innocence as a child trapped in a mans body and its not Zelda IMO. But I guess Zelda solved that problem and sent him back to the Child Timeline for a romance between her and Link to be far less awkward.

Though I clearly prefer Malon based on your reasons that would make you choose Zelda, I don't think Zelda being not as weak as Malon is a bad thing. I like LinkxAshi for TP and IMO thats similar to a LinkxZelda in the OOT Child timeline, only in the similarity that Ashi is a strong warrior woman like Zelda is a Sheikah. Of course there is obvious differences between OOT Zelda and Ashi but I was just refering that they are both women who don't really need a man to protect them as a Malon or Illia would.

Originally Posted by Blackfire667

1stly: You're making this rather im-personal, your writing style is less casual... I think you're getting frustrated! Running out of cards to play?

2: Sweet singing voice??? I don't know what quality of sound YOUR speakers cough up! OoT is on the N64! That's about two generations old! It's got the sound quality of... Well... An N64... So your imagination must be rather musically inclined.

3: Would you like someone to break into your house and leave a freaking cow there???? That must stink to high-heaven!

4: The royal meeting likely would not happen in the courtyard. So, if this happens to Link at all, he'd be free to roam the courtyard. Maybe get a nice tan in the sun or nap in the shade. Or even go for a swim! There is water there, you know. Not like anyone is watching.

5: You seem to be under the impression that the King hates Link from the start. Likely, if Zelda made a new friend, he would not go out of his way to make the boy miserable, thus up-setting Zelda. Now, the King would'nt want to make his beloved daughter cry after he had Link "Beaten to a bloody pulp". That mean he's a tyrant, and really not much better than Ganondorf!

As for my supposed "crime" it wasn't nearly as bad as the mod made it seem. Just an example of a flirtatious sentence that would be very out of character for Zelda. In fact, I see no reason to apologise!

No Blackfire. The royal meetings would probably be in the throne room. Link being in the courtyard is just for Zeldas reference in knowing where he would be after the royal meeting was over. And no Link would not be taking a swim or getting a tan!!! He will do as he is told and stand in the corner facing the wall and just stand there with his creepy blank stare until Zelda comes back and gives him permission to move again.

And you don't like Malon's sweet voice?? Your obviously tone deaf my friend. And that cow in Links house is more than that. IMO its symbolic of LinkxMalons growing affectionate love for each other. GO LINKXMALON

As for the King beating up Link, its just my own sick fantasy that I would love to make cuddly forest child Links life a living hell if I were King.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

I've never read the manga, but I heard its an idealistically well written storyline for Zelda shippers only. But I still would give it a read if I could. To me a series of books or manga in the child timeline would give more material for romance in a LinkxZelda than the adult timeline IMO.

I don't think you should sell it short like that. Yes Link and Zelda's romance is a central element to the story ( and it's beautiful, especially the ending ) but it's still a fun read. I think the reason it gets a bad rap by shippers is because it's very clear, no mistaking: Link loves Zelda. Malon herself even says it. Saria is more a friend and Ruto ends her connection with Link, just like in the game.
But the characters are treated with respect and it has a good story.

Don't get me wrong, I would still give it a read. I'm rather intrigued in what words are used for Links speech. Judging from the quote on your sig, I can guess that his personality is more closer to the more standard kinder and gentler Link of today than the one in the 80's cartoon for sure. If you want to spoil me, and tell me they got married in the Manga thats cool. But I still think the possibility of marriage for LinkxZelda can only happen in the Child Timeline.

As for TP I really don't know. Zelda to me seems far less affectionate and reassuring and rather more indifferent than OOT Zelda. I don't see TP Zelda giving that much praise to Link for his heroic deeds as OOT Zelda would to her Link. Not to mention that it would seem that TP Link saving her would be dismissed as "Well he has the TOC so it was his duty to save me anyway"and thats pretty much it. I believe you mentioned this, but the TP Link and Zelda relationship seems to be simply more formal and business like and I can't picture Zelda engaging Link in private casual conversation other than addressing him formally on strictly his hero duties.

As for Link its even worse. His common born status and his signature shy and gentle personality are far bigger obstacles to overcome than it would be for OOT Link, who at least has the advantage of an established friendship with Zelda to maybe overcome them. All I can see is that it would be business as usual in the social life of the Hyrule court as Zelda is chatting, giggling, and smiling away in casual conversation with her more qualified and well spoken suitors. All the while Link stands at a considerable distance away from Zelda and her suitors admiring her and wondering on what it would be like to engage in a casual conversation with her, in which she would be giggling and smiling at him for his sharp wit and eloquent speaking. When I think about it, I feel real sorry and sympathetic for TP Link because I really think he would have genuine romantic feelings for Zelda but it seems that there would be nothing for me to believe that Link can do anything to get her to feel the same way about him. All I can see is Link accepting that a romantic relationship with Zelda is pretty much hopelessly out of reach and all he can do is be the perfect gentleman and continue to obey her royal commands and perform his hero duty to the best of his ability in hopes that one day Zelda will notice him enough to finally engage in a casual conversation with him instead of addressing him in the more likely formal conversations as the common born hero of Hyrule with the TOC.

So Gilderpilot, what are your angles in helping TP Link overcome his dillemas to be with the more reserved and formal TP Zelda?

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

Don't get me wrong, I would still give it a read. I'm rather intrigued in what words are used for Links speech. Judging from the quote on your sig, I can guess that his personality is more closer to the more standard kinder and gentler Link of today than the one in the 80's cartoon for sure. If you want to spoil me, and tell me they got married in the Manga thats cool. But I still think the possibility of marriage for LinkxZelda can only happen in the Child Timeline.

As for TP I really don't know. Zelda to me seems far less affectionate and reassuring and rather more indifferent than OOT Zelda. I don't see TP Zelda giving that much praise to Link for his heroic deeds as OOT Zelda would to her Link. Not to mention that it would seem that TP Link saving her would be dismissed as "Well he has the TOC so it was his duty to save me anyway"and thats pretty much it. I believe you mentioned this, but the TP Link and Zelda relationship seems to be simply more formal and business like and I can't picture Zelda engaging Link in private casual conversation other than addressing him formally on strictly his hero duties.

As for Link its even worse. His common born status and his signature shy and gentle personality are far bigger obstacles to overcome than it would be for OOT Link, who at least has the advantage of an established friendship with Zelda to maybe overcome them. All I can see is that it would be business as usual in the social life of the Hyrule court as Zelda is chatting, giggling, and smiling away in casual conversation with her more qualified and well spoken suitors. All the while Link stands at a considerable distance away from Zelda and her suitors admiring her and wondering on what it would be like to engage in a casual conversation with her, in which she would be giggling and smiling at him for his sharp wit and eloquent speaking. When I think about it, I feel real sorry and sympathetic for TP Link because I really think he would have genuine romantic feelings for Zelda but it seems that there would be nothing for me to believe that Link can do anything to get her to feel the same way about him. All I can see is Link accepting that a romantic relationship with Zelda is pretty much hopelessly out of reach and all he can do is be the perfect gentleman and continue to obey her royal commands and perform his hero duty to the best of his ability in hopes that one day Zelda will notice him enough to finally engage in a casual conversation with him instead of addressing him in the more likely formal conversations as the common born hero of Hyrule with the TOC.

So Gilderpilot, what are your angles in helping TP Link overcome his dillemas to be with the more reserved and formal TP Zelda?

I feel sorry for poor link. Always talked to formally by zelda, and longing for a casual conversation.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

I've never read the manga, but I heard its an idealistically well written storyline for Zelda shippers only. But I still would give it a read if I could. To me a series of books or manga in the child timeline would give more material for romance in a LinkxZelda than the adult timeline IMO. It can start at the end of the OOT adventure where Link passes a test or trial to prove that he has the TOC. Then he goes through his supervised training with the knights where Zelda will always be present to kiss his little boo boos and give him plenty of hugs of reassurance along the way and with her beneficial guidance over the years, Link would make Zelda very proud by the time he came of age. Link of course would be more than thankful that Zelda was always there to provide him with the affectionate love and reassurance that he desperately needed in his formative years to become a hero and BAM they fall in love and both of them conspire to kill the King of Hyrule so they can legally be married. THE END

In the Child Timeline, after the MM adventure, we don't really know what Hyrule's state of condition is but its fun to speculate there would be a need for a hero and a princess to work together to maintain order and stability. In the Adult Timeline it clearly states that there is now peace in Hyrule, therefore Link is no longer needed and has no purpose to his existence except he needs a female to give him the love and affection he desperately craves. As I stated before, it boils down to the love interest more likely to teach him the birds and the bees to overcome his naive innocence as a child trapped in a mans body and its not Zelda IMO. But I guess Zelda solved that problem and sent him back to the Child Timeline for a romance between her and Link to be far less awkward.

Though I clearly prefer Malon based on your reasons that would make you choose Zelda, I don't think Zelda being not as weak as Malon is a bad thing. I like LinkxAshi for TP and IMO thats similar to a LinkxZelda in the OOT Child timeline, only in the similarity that Ashi is a strong warrior woman like Zelda is a Sheikah. Of course there is obvious differences between OOT Zelda and Ashi but I was just refering that they are both women who don't really need a man to protect them as a Malon or Illia would.


No Blackfire. The royal meetings would probably be in the throne room. Link being in the courtyard is just for Zeldas reference in knowing where he would be after the royal meeting was over. And no Link would not be taking a swim or getting a tan!!! He will do as he is told and stand in the corner facing the wall and just stand there with his creepy blank stare until Zelda comes back and gives him permission to move again.

And you don't like Malon's sweet voice?? Your obviously tone deaf my friend. And that cow in Links house is more than that. IMO its symbolic of LinkxMalons growing affectionate love for each other. GO LINKXMALON

As for the King beating up Link, its just my own sick fantasy that I would love to make cuddly forest child Links life a living hell if I were King.

1st off: I'd think that, by the time Link passed whatever Mortal Kombat-like "trial" you and your twisted mind thought up, he'd be tough enough to go through some training!

2: Kill the King??? I can somehow picture that... Zelda: "Hey Link, wanna kill my father who likely raised me from birth so we can get married?" Link: "Uhh... ok!" ... Let's think these things through a bit more, next time, shall we?

3: Why would'nt Zelda teach him the birds and the bees??? She'll just direct him to a book or get someone else (a servant) to do it! And this is only if she can't do it herself!

4: Since the Child timeline is the only one that actually exists, does this mean you're admitting ZeldaxLink IS more likely?

5: Maybe I didn't point out the throne room specifically BUT that is more-or-less what I said!!!!!! And he would totally do any of those things because doesn't have a creepy blank stare forever fixed on his face!!!!

6: Again, IT'S AN N64! It's considered ancient! I'll admit Malon can carry a tune but don't exaggerate! The ancient console doesn't exactly emit quality sound!

7: IT IS A COW! CCOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWW!!!! NOT HEART PIECE, NOT LOCKET, NOT EVEN A CARVING OF "Link and Malon forever" IN A HEART! IT IS A CCCOOOOOOOWWWWWW!!!!! COW! You know: "MOOO!" *Primal roar*

And finally: I guess we're all lucky that you're not the King, huh? If, in one Zelda game, I somehow recognised you sitting on that throne I would end up screaming "GET OUT OF MY GAME" at my television. This, after millions of "game overs" because you raised the difficulty level... Mr."Broken fingernail"....

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

Don't get me wrong, I would still give it a read. I'm rather intrigued in what words are used for Links speech. Judging from the quote on your sig, I can guess that his personality is more closer to the more standard kinder and gentler Link of today than the one in the 80's cartoon for sure. If you want to spoil me, and tell me they got married in the Manga thats cool. But I still think the possibility of marriage for LinkxZelda can only happen in the Child Timeline.

For Link's dialogue, he's certainly not quiet. He also matures over the course of the story, something I liked quite a bit. He's pretty informal, that quote just recalls a particularily deep speech. I loved Link's personality in the manga.

The manga is the comic book adaptation of the OoT story...there's no HUGE deviations from what we've already seen. So no, Link and Zelda don't get married. He made that speech after he had accepted he had to go back in time.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

As for TP I really don't know. Zelda to me seems far less affectionate and reassuring and rather more indifferent than OOT Zelda. I don't see TP Zelda giving that much praise to Link for his heroic deeds as OOT Zelda would to her Link. Not to mention that it would seem that TP Link saving her would be dismissed as "Well he has the TOC so it was his duty to save me anyway"and thats pretty much it. I believe you mentioned this, but the TP Link and Zelda relationship seems to be simply more formal and business like and I can't picture Zelda engaging Link in private casual conversation other than addressing him formally on strictly his hero duties.

As for Link its even worse. His common born status and his signature shy and gentle personality are far bigger obstacles to overcome than it would be for OOT Link, who at least has the advantage of an established friendship with Zelda to maybe overcome them. All I can see is that it would be business as usual in the social life of the Hyrule court as Zelda is chatting, giggling, and smiling away in casual conversation with her more qualified and well spoken suitors. All the while Link stands at a considerable distance away from Zelda and her suitors admiring her and wondering on what it would be like to engage in a casual conversation with her, in which she would be giggling and smiling at him for his sharp wit and eloquent speaking.

I mostly agree with you up to here.

He doesn't have the established relationship that OoT/MM Link had with Zelda, and would likely feel mighty awkward around her. Unlike OoT/MM Link, he's had time to grow up, make a life for himself and solidify his personality...MM Link is still a kid, he'd likely find it easier to adapt to castle vs farm life.

I really don't think TP Link is seriously interested in his Zelda either, beyond admiring her. When I think TP Link, I think a "what if" OoT Link had never left the forest until age 17? He would grown closer and more inseperable from Saria, hence what we have with Ilia. She's very much Saria with a bit of Malon thrown in.

Originally Posted by Blackfire667

3: Why would'nt Zelda teach him the birds and the bees??? She'll just direct him to a book or get someone else (a servant) to do it! And this is only if she can't do it herself!

LOL!! Shame on you Blackfire!! Zelda would never corrupt sweet puppy dog Link in that way. And of course he will loyally obey Zelda, creepy blank stare and all. This is puppy dog Link we are talking about remember??

I obviously was kidding about the King ordering a beat down on Link earlier. The theoretical trial to prove that Link has the TOC could be Link showing a birthmark on his butt as far as I care.

And I thought I made it clear that a LinkxZelda is more likely in the child timeline, but I still think that Malon can have a positive influence starting from childhood in molding Link from adorable cherub like forest child that likes to visit often, into the loyal and loving knight in shining armor that she always dreamed about. And who will stay with her forever in LonLon ranch when he finally becomes the hero that will loyally protect her and and all the nearby citizens of Hyrule as well.

Originally Posted by gliderpilotgirl

I mostly agree with you up to here.

He doesn't have the established relationship that OoT/MM Link had with Zelda, and would likely feel mighty awkward around her. Unlike OoT/MM Link, he's had time to grow up, make a life for himself and solidify his personality...MM Link is still a kid, he'd likely find it easier to adapt to castle vs farm life.

I really don't think TP Link is seriously interested in his Zelda either, beyond admiring her. When I think TP Link, I think a "what if" OoT Link had never left the forest until age 17? He would grown closer and more inseperable from Saria, hence what we have with Ilia. She's very much Saria with a bit of Malon thrown in.

Its nice to see that we generally agree sometimes. But yeah...when I think of the unlikelyhood of a LinkxZelda in TP, I think about the scolding from Illia and the excitedly aroused look Link gets when the great fairy touches his cheek. If he allows himself to be a submissive doormat to an ugly duckling commoner like Illia, imagine how badly he will be comically dominated by Zelda. And if he gets that worked up when a strange looking fairy touches him, he would probably crap in his trousers and feint if Zelda did the same thing to him. I don't think Zelda would be interested in someone with Links personality, and she does not seem the type to give Link nurturing reassurance as OOT Zelda does to give Link the self confidence he needs to feel worthy of Zelda's love.

But I like to think TP Link would find true love eventually. At this moment I can see two possibilities.

1. He eventually settles down with a common Hyrule town girl and Zelda marries a random Hyrule nobleman to keep the royal bloodline going. Yet Link and Zelda continue to have a cooperative business like working relationship as a hero/ruler team in uniting the TOC and TOW to maintain stability and order in Hyrule.

2. He resigns from the life of a hero, because Zelda doesn't appreciate his heroic deeds as much as he would want her to. Compounded by the likely heartbreak that its inevitable that she will choose a more qualified Hyrule nobleman to marry instead of him, so he goes crawling back to Ordon to be with Illia who will likely still be standing there on the same spot awaiting for Links return.

Personally I would prefer the former instead of the latter. Yes...I still hate Illia.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

And I thought I made it clear that a LinkxZelda is more likely in the child timeline, but I still think that Malon can have a positive influence starting from childhood in molding Link from adorable cherub like forest child that likes to visit often, into the loyal and loving knight in shining armor that she always dreamed about. And who will stay with her forever in LonLon ranch when he finally becomes the hero that will loyally protect her and and all the nearby citizens of Hyrule as well.

It's funny, because when you say loyalty, that's something I can never picture coming from Link towards Malon. Not that he's a cheater ( being totally honorable ) it's just he's never seemed to give her any special attention to begin with: to picture him being totally loyal and hopelessly in love with her seems to be taking him almost out of character, IMO. He doesn't act like he's in love with Malon.

Malon may want her knight, but I think as time went on it would become increasingly clear ( if she's remotely smart enough to read Link ) that he's not her knight: he's got too many feelings for and angst about Zelda. ( The former was the conclusion of the manga )
I also think Malon herself is more in love with love as a concept than Link himself...he just fits the bill. That's not what I associate with real love: I don't think it would ever work out.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

Its nice to see that we generally agree sometimes. But yeah...when I think of the unlikelyhood of a LinkxZelda in TP, I think about the scolding from Illia and the excitedly aroused look Link gets when the great fairy touches his cheek. If he allows himself to be a submissive doormat to an ugly duckling commoner like Illia, imagine how badly he will be comically dominated by Zelda. And if he gets that worked up when a strange looking fairy touches him, he would probably crap in his trousers and feint if Zelda did the same thing to him. I don't think Zelda would be interested in someone with Links personality, and she does not seem the type to give Link nurturing reassurance as OOT Zelda does to give Link the self confidence he needs to feel worthy of Zelda's love.

I've never made it down to the bottom of the Cave of Ordeals. The Great Fairy touches his cheek...and he reacts?

Zelda may be reserved ( and a bit cold in comparison to OoT Zelda ) but I'd be shocked if she wasn't attracted to him. At least after she got to know him. He's every woman's dream man: brave, kind, good looking: I doubt she'd ever find his equal. The only thing that may go against him is his lack of protocol...but she may find that honesty and simplicity refreshing.

Then let me ask you this. If Link is not her knight in shining armor then who is?? Ingo? the potion shop guy?? I rest my case. To me using the manga as justification that Malon will just give up on Link so he can be with Zelda is like using the Zelda cartoon to support a LinkxZelda and if you choose that route thats cool. IMO both the cartoon and the manga are still irrelevant to the in game evidence that Malon desires her knight in shining armor(Link) and by going the typical Zelda shipper route and speculate that its probably a CONCEPT of another random knight character that does not even exist is very weak if you ask me.

I agree on the issue of Links interest in Malon but the same can be said about his interest in Zelda. Must I refer to the MM scene that he WILLINGLY left Zelda even after she expressed her feelings that she did not want him to leave?? I'm not saying it supports or denies a LinkxMalon, despite him showing up with Epona loyally by his side as if to symbolically say "Too bad Zelda, Malon is my good friend too". But the MM scene to me spoke volumes that symbolically the hero and princess are not destined to be together always and forever. Perhaps Link has another destiny??Hmm I wonder with who?? As for why he remembered Zelda and not Malon, it had a lot more to do with remembering the SONG OF TIME than any unfounded notion that he is going to marry Zelda one day.

Sorry to spoil that for you on Link and the fairy.As for TP, I like to think that Zelda would one day notice Link for the good job he does in fulfilling his obligations as the resident hero with the TOC and maybe as a reward she can invite him to his first royal ball and allow him to be her chaperone. With TP who knows but I still see Link as just being unrequited admirer from afar, but maybe by a miracle Link can become more assertive in his personality and speech for Zelda to notice him romantically but highly unlikely. With LinkxZelda I'm still:

OOT Child timeline=Good chance

TP= Very small chance

OOT Adult timeline= No chance.

Originally Posted by Blackfire667

1st off: I'd think that, by the time Link passed whatever Mortal Kombat-like "trial" you and your twisted mind thought up, he'd be tough enough to go through some training!

2: Kill the King??? I can somehow picture that... Zelda: "Hey Link, wanna kill my father who likely raised me from birth so we can get married?" Link: "Uhh... ok!" ... Let's think these things through a bit more, next time, shall we?

3: Why would'nt Zelda teach him the birds and the bees??? She'll just direct him to a book or get someone else (a servant) to do it! And this is only if she can't do it herself!

4: Since the Child timeline is the only one that actually exists, does this mean you're admitting ZeldaxLink IS more likely?

5: Maybe I didn't point out the throne room specifically BUT that is more-or-less what I said!!!!!! And he would totally do any of those things because doesn't have a creepy blank stare forever fixed on his face!!!!

6: Again, IT'S AN N64! It's considered ancient! I'll admit Malon can carry a tune but don't exaggerate! The ancient console doesn't exactly emit quality sound!

7: IT IS A COW! CCOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWW!!!! NOT HEART PIECE, NOT LOCKET, NOT EVEN A CARVING OF "Link and Malon forever" IN A HEART! IT IS A CCCOOOOOOOWWWWWW!!!!! COW! You know: "MOOO!" *Primal roar*

And finally: I guess we're all lucky that you're not the King, huh? If, in one Zelda game, I somehow recognised you sitting on that throne I would end up screaming "GET OUT OF MY GAME" at my television. This, after millions of "game overs" because you raised the difficulty level... Mr."Broken fingernail"....

2. As he said, it's his own sick mind.

3. I agree with you to an extent here. She is able to teach Link quite a bit, but, being that she is an important person, she is likely quite sheltered and her knowledge is actually somewhat limited to whatever she can learn inside the castle, while Malon isn't some sheltered child, and is likely to be more knowledgable about the outside world than Zelda.

5. No, you just said courtyard. I would imagine that, while the courtyard on the ground floor and outdoors, it is the complete opposite of the throne room, which would be indoors and likely somewhere near the top and back of the castle.

6. I think that if there was an OoT remake with better graphics, sound, basically what everybody is hoping for in that dream FFVII remake, that it would sound quite beautiful, seeing as the N64 version pulled it off quite well.

7. WOW, nobody is funnier when ranting in an almost pissed off style as you... well, maybe Dr. Cox, but anyway, the cow was a prize, so I think that ganonslayer's "symbol of affection" is WAY off, but it isn't anything negative, either.

And I'd be fine as long as a Zelda game that he makes isn't as hard as AoL.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

Then let me ask you this. If Link is not her knight in shining armor then who is?? Ingo? the potion shop guy?? I rest my case. To me using the manga as justification that Malon will just give up on Link so he can be with Zelda is like using the Zelda cartoon to support a LinkxZelda and if you choose that route thats cool. IMO both the cartoon and the manga are still irrelevant to the in game evidence that Malon desires her knight in shining armor(Link) and by going the typical Zelda shipper route and speculate that its probably a CONCEPT of another random knight character that does not even exist is very weak if you ask me.

What is weak ( IMO ) is assuming that only those we see on screen are Hyrule's entire population. It's not much of a kingdom if you only have 50-200 people. A real kingdom likely has thousands and hundreds of thousands of people, even a small one. That means there are lots of farms, small villages and many people we don't see on screen or in the playable areas. Link is not the only eligible man in Hyrule. Nor is Malon the only eager farmgirl who wants a hero. You're going to have to explain to me how she is unique...or how her very typical girlhood dream can only be fulfilled by Link.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

I agree on the issue of Links interest in Malon but the same can be said about his interest in Zelda. Must I refer to the MM scene that he WILLINGLY left Zelda even after she expressed her feelings that she did not want him to leave??

Yup, and he seemed kind of angsty about it later too. Or at least that was the mood of the scene.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

I'm not saying it supports or denies a LinkxMalon, despite him showing up with Epona loyally by his side as if to symbolically say "Too bad Zelda, Malon is my good friend too".

Malon had nothing to do with that scene, nor is she mentioned the entire game. Epona is just there...she doesn't necessarily represent Malon. Overall, I think Malon gets more attention from the fanbase than she does from the game.

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

But the MM scene to me spoke volumes that symbolically the hero and princess are not destined to be together always and forever. Perhaps Link has another destiny??Hmm I wonder with who??

You could see it that way...but the ending of OoT is in contrast to it, as many other endings with Link and Zelda are. It should also be noted that Malon has shown up in no less than 3 other games ( plus Romani and Cremia ) and not one of them has Link showing any romantic interest in her. Why is OoT Link so drastically different? ( He's not, IMO. )

Originally Posted by Ganonslayer2000

As for why he remembered Zelda and not Malon, it had a lot more to do with remembering the SONG OF TIME than any unfounded notion that he is going to marry Zelda one day.

This has come up before. It's the way the game treated it that makes it important. "This reminds me of us" ( emphasis mine )..."This song, lingering on the edges of your mind, is a song of memories of Princess Zelda" The game gives it a specific personal meaning for Link, unlike the others. You can try to infer " A song of two who are bound by trust" implies Romani/Malon: but the header is, "The horse really likes this song." That infers that the song is about Epona and Link...not Malon.

3 words IN GAME EVIDENCE. I don't know where your going with this stuff about Hyrule having a population like the Roman Empire. Your the one that has the burden of proof on this ridiculous conceptual imaginary other knight for Malon. IN GAME EVIDENCE obviously points to Link as Malons knight in shining armor. I'm not saying that its concrete proof that Link will marry Malon but more to Malon having a big crush on Link to possibly make him hers one day and nothing more.

Another thing, what did you mean that the OOT ending contrasts/contradicts my opinionated meaning of the MM cutscene?? The OOT ending takes place BEFORE that MM cutscene remember? And I never meant to say that Epona represents Malon, but rather its a good indication that Link has a relevant and meaningful friendship with Malon instead of an exclusive friendship with Zelda only.

Anyway...I'm going out of my Malon shipper character for the moment and say that there is enough subtle hints in both OOT and MM that may indicate that BOTH Zelda and Malon like Link. But there is nothing there that indicates Link feeling anything special for any one of them other than a possible platonic friendship and thats it. Its easy to believe that Link might be attracted to a Malon with the Cremia hug and its also easy to believe that Link might be attracted to Zelda simply since she is depicted to be attractive and that the game series is named after her. But since the OOT Link Child timeline ends at MM there is no real evidence whatsoever to know for sure who Link ends up with.

So whether he ends up being Zeldas lapdog or Malons knight in shining armor who knows. But I like to believe that Link would choose Zelda or Malon based on true love rather than us (Zelda and Malon shippers)believing in ridiculous things like social status, vague quotes & prologues, horses, triforces, magical armors, non cannonical mangas/cartoons, ocarinas and songs as irrelevant and unrelated proof that Link will end up marrying whoever. Now that I'm singing CUMBAYA I've got one thing to say.

GO LINKXMALON WOOOHOOO Lets get that 100th vote to catch up with Zelda !!!

Uhh, need I bring up the whole "blank canvas" thing again? Link ends up with who WE want him to end up with! If you look hard enough, there's probably infinite evidence to support both. But only if you look really, really hard. And stop bringing up the cartoon... 'Dorkieness' overload! But aside from my peaceful attitude at the moment...


ZELINK FOR EVAH!!!!!! ZELDAxLINK PWNS ALL!!!! WE'RE STILL OVER 62 VOTES AHEAD!!!!! WOOOOT!!!!! My enthusiasim is better than yours, GanonSlayer!