Where Does Metroid Go?

What direction should Nintendo go in for the next console installment of the Metroid franchise?

1.) Other M engine

2.) Metroid Prime engine

3.) 2D side scroller

4.) Other (explain)


I'm interested to see how this goes.

I would be thrilled with (2) or (3). For me (1) is unacceptable and death for the franchise. I probably wouldn't consider playing it unless I saw something profound that piqued my curiosity. As for (4), it's almost hard to imagine what other form Metroid could take. A conventional shooter? Not too keen on that. A third person action plat-former that uses a different engine than Other M? I'd give it a look. But I think it is very hard to construct a great game in that genre, particularly one that would in any way capture the feel and intricacies of the classics.

The Metroid Prime engine. It was very easy to get into, and you weren't a rat in a maze like the original Metroid, so it was not as hard to explore, and I thought it was a bit more fun to explore, because the world felt more open, and you could see the world around you develop. That, and it just worked out well with the Metroid series, and the Prime Trilogy are considered some of the most beloved Metroid titles.

Metroid Other M engine (note: engine ONLY), Metroid Prime level of detail and intricacy of design, Metroid Fusion quality and frequency of boss encounters, Super Metroid storytelling style, musical score in the style of the original.

While I didn't really have much of a problem with Other M's story, that's DEFINITELY not the desirable direction for the series, but on the other hand I loved its controls and visuals and think that if they were applied to a more "traditional" Metroid approach they'd be more successful. Other M tried too hard to be cinematic (and devoted too much disc space to this end) and not hard enough to be a quality game, and for me that was really what bothered me about it.

I'd like the return of the Scan Visor, but with a happy medium between Prime's and the version seen in Other M - if you point at something and lock onto it, you'll get some information about it, but it'd be a bit lighter than the text-heavy Prime.

Nah. Metroid Prime engine has been used up for now. I'd rather see a return to classic 2D Metroid. I'm thinking along the lines of Donkey Kong Country Returns.

As Lex said, I wouldn't mind another Other M engine game, as long as they don't screw up all the same things that Other M did. The engine itself was sound- it was just design choices that crippled it.

Of course, knowing Nintendo, an entirely new engine will probably come out of nowhere and blow us all away. :3

If there was one thing I liked about Other M, it was seeing Samus from the third person perspective. It was satisfying to see her do her traditional spin jumping.

I really, really wish there was an effective way to translate 2D to 3D, but it just doesn't seem possible. There are unavoidable issues with camera angles and control that transcend the talent of the developers--even if their focus was on the right things.

For example, I don't like the necessity of a dynamic camera. While all of the game play in the 2D games (and FPS) is uniform, most 3D action games require shifting camera angles to accommodate the environment. This can be cinematic, but I think it is a huge weakness of third person action games. The flow of the game just feels disjointed.

Now RE4 is a good counter example. The camera in that game was stable. But Leon is not as acrobatic as Samus (indeed, even turning to the side is a bit of a burden), the corridors aren't as tight, the environment is flatter, and even then it relied heavily on context sensitive actions.

I just don't like the 3D action genre as a rule. It's messy. But, I do agree that the developers could produce a superior game to Other M if they fixed their priorities.

The Metroid Prime engine.

I agree. I know a fourth game with that engine sounds like overkill, but I think there was still more potential. Again, I think Retro Studious got sidetracked with their priorities, particularly in the third. Not nearly to the degree of Other M, and Prime 2 and 3 are still great games, but there is so much more I would have liked to see with the Prime Engine. I have a ton of mini "fantasies" like taking exploring under hot lava with the Gravity suit, for example. I also think the speed booster could work quite well in the Prime engine. And how about enhanced (Wiimotion + enabled) grapple beam functionality? Intentional nonlinear design/sequence breaking? It was sad to see Prime 2 and 3 move away from that. A little glitch in the controls of Prime 1 that allowed you to collect the Space Jump as the first item in the game made the whole experience SO much more exciting and replayable. It peeves me when developers go out of their way to prevent this kind of experience.

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That said, a 2D reboot akin to NSMB and DKJB could be spectacular. Retro may be sick of Metroid, but I think they are the perfect team to take up such a project. The "truest" Metroid experience will always be the 2D side-scroller. What they really need to do is combine the best aspects of Super (new moves, atmosphere) with the best aspects of the original (particularly challenge).

I'm honestly a bit torn on the dynamic camera thing myself because that was really my only problem with Other M's control scheme - there's no way to adjust the camera angle. At the same time I really enjoyed the whole switching from third to first person thing and adding Nunchuk control to give camera options would make that less... impactful. (I thought about saying "intuitive" but adding the Nunchuk would add an additional button, so it'd still be POSSIBLE.)

But I didn't think it was a particularly grating flaw; the way they clearly sacrificed gameplay for story (all but two items are obtained through "automatic" equipment updates; obvious scrapped climax with Sector 0; etc.) was really the worst offender.

Originally Posted by Lex

I'm honestly a bit torn on the dynamic camera thing myself because that was really my only problem with Other M's control scheme - there's no way to adjust the camera angle.

To me, I don't view it as a "problem" so much as an inherent, unavoidable trait of a 3D action game.

In 2D, you can create level designs that feel cohesive and consistent that just wouldn't make sense in 3D. Because the 2D perspective is so blatantly unrealistic to begin with, you (or at least I) hold it to a different "standard." The level design simply makes more sense in the context of the game's world, even if it is far less realistic compared to our world.

I just don't think there is much to be gained from the ability to move in 8 directions. Yes, it's technically more realistic, but it feels more constrained. The entire control scheme has to be adapted to accommodate it. And yet, the combat is essentially still 2D since there is lock on--in fact it's even less complex since we have auto-aim instead of having to manually aim.

Again, I can't blame the developer for these choices. It's much harder to create a functional control scheme for a 3D action game (especially when you limit yourself to Wiimote only). I think such a system should only be pursued if it offers real advantages. I would argue that it doesn't, overall. Any benefit is minor compared to the new constraints.

What I do blame the developer for is the entire concept of switching perspectives, particularly in the middle of combat. All that does, along with the camera angles, is create more disjointed game play. It takes you out of the experience; instead of one uniform play style, you have an awkward mismash--a consequence of having to make this strange game play functional. I think it is fundamentally flawed to have to continually switch perspectives in the middle of combat. Of course, you'd be a sitting duck in FP, so they had to throw in the "dodge" move, which is arguably overpowered, and another example of the awkward mishmash that is Other M.

To be completely honest, I don't think I ever fully adapted to the control scheme . . .

This is why, aside from how you or I feel about Other M's overall "quality," I don't want the series to continue in this direction. As I said, I agree they could make a better game, but it's hard for me to imagine a truly sensible control scheme.

Split up the game into two alternating sections, one half would be a JRPG and the other half would be a racing game with quick time events.

I'd say 2D Metroid for now.

There's no reason something like Other M couldn't work (I'd make it entirely a 3rd-person shooter, not the weird hybrid they chose) either, but I suspect that the whole concept is tainted now (for me, because of what Other M did to Samus as a character, others have their own reasons, but no one seems to have liked it much) and probably won't recover for at least a generation.

Still, 2D could work very, very well. Use high-res sprites (3D doesn't work as well for platforming, but could be used, I s'pose, so long as there's no pixel-perfect jumps required...), well-animated backgrounds, and you could have a next-gen Metroid that looks next-gen but plays more like Super.

8bits idea makes total sense. I agree.

i just love metroid prime with the fps style of gameplay (especially in the trilogy edition) i just had more fun with it (and the games are alot longer)

To a talented developer.

Originally Posted by Lex

Metroid Other M engine (note: engine ONLY), Metroid Prime level of detail and intricacy of design, Metroid Fusion quality and frequency of boss encounters, Super Metroid storytelling style, musical score in the style of the original.

While I didn't really have much of a problem with Other M's story, that's DEFINITELY not the desirable direction for the series, but on the other hand I loved its controls and visuals and think that if they were applied to a more "traditional" Metroid approach they'd be more successful. Other M tried too hard to be cinematic (and devoted too much disc space to this end) and not hard enough to be a quality game, and for me that was really what bothered me about it.

I'd like the return of the Scan Visor, but with a happy medium between Prime's and the version seen in Other M - if you point at something and lock onto it, you'll get some information about it, but it'd be a bit lighter than the text-heavy Prime.

Exactly what Lex said. That'd make an amazing Metroid game.

4.

After New Super Mario Bros., Yoshi's Story, Kirby's Epic Yarn, and whatever else there is out there in the subgenre, I'd love to see a 2.5D Metroid game.

Okay: Where Metroid should go is a three step process.

#1: Metroid Other M route, which fixes Samus's character completely.

#2: Go as far away from that route as humanly possible, going back to the Prime days.

#3: Profit.

@ Billiam: I think the constraints of 2D side-scrolling perspectives are about on par with the constraints of a fixed 3D perspective (like that of Other M), but if the 3D perspective is not fixed (for example, in Zelda or Okami, where the only limits of the camera are that it can't go into the wall), it lacks these constraints altogether. I don't think 2D or 3D is superior or inferior in this respect.

As for the switching perspective thing- I dunno, I found it about as much of a break in game flow as, say, switching to your missiles to deliver a critical blow to a boss in Super Metroid.

Metroid started as a 2d series, and thats what I wished it remained as. I'm sure the Prime games are good, but they don't feel like Metroid to me. The 2d games were really eerie and really captured the isolation theme well.

The 2D games for sure. I really don't like the direction the series took when the prime games came out. They may be good in all, but they're still just FPS games. The 2D Metroid games are such a more unique experience. Super Metroid, in my opinion, is easily the best in the whole entire series. If Nintendo concentrated on making a new Metroid game more akin to Super Metroid(and Metroid 1, having a sense of exploration instead of having set destination like Zero Mission and Fusion) than any of the other 2d games, that would be great.

Other M's engine would be super-fun if it weren't for the average level design full of invisible walls and cinematic camera angles and extreme focus on the narrative and bland-ass music. The combat was fast-paced and fun and that had some of the funnest and coolest boss fights in the whole series and the controls lend themselves well enough to exploration and platforming during the slow parts.
Anybody who says this engine has no potential clearly did not battle with Phantoon.

Metriod Prime had a solid run. One of the best trilogies in video game history. Either control set is wonderful and my only gripe is that 3 took on too much narrative focus and broke up the level design too much with its interplanetary travel. But it's been done to death and, frankly, I don't think it can do better than it already has. I'd play it if they made another one, I'd buy it in a heartbeat, but I don't think there's much at all new to do with it and after three and a half diverse games I'm done with it.

Anybody who's opposed to a new 2D Metroid deserves to be shot. But 2D just isn't the direction to go for a console Metroid. A new 2D or 2.5D game on the DS or 3DS? All for it. But I feel that if they made a 2D Metroid on the Wii, the controls would suffer. 2D Metroid needs shoulder buttons to control well, there's no arguments to be had in this department. After playing Super or a GBA game, Metroid and Metroid II have terrible ****ing controls. And Nintendo's never going to make a game optomized for the Classic Controller over their beloved remote and/or nun-chuck.

Something totally new gets my vote.

The series before Prime was, more than just lonely, scary. Metroid and Metroid 2 did it with bleak spaces and dreary music. For the time, that was enough. Super Metroid really took the cake with this, though, and for somebody who's familiar with it it's hard to think of it as a scary game but try to recall the first time you played it. The tension when you first go through CERES or the still-empty Zebes or the haunted shipwreck with no electricity is thick enough that you can cut it with a knife, and it really took advantage of Mode 7 effects to scare the pants off you with Ridley and the breaking-down CERES station, made you **** yourself when revealing Kraid's full body and Crocomire's death sequence. Fusion very effectively used chase sequences with the SA-X and gave us the Nightmare, which is still one of the most disturbing bosses I've ever encountered in a video game. Metroid used to be scary.
Echoes and Other M touched upon the old-school tone at times but still had an overwhelmingly heroic tone.
A couple years ago I played a game that felt like a natural progression from old-school Metroid. It was not open-ended but at least encouraged exploration, it was moody and unnerving with some proper-scary set pieces and effective use of graphics technology, a good many jump-scares for good measure, a dark sci-fi setting with alien monsters, and a faceless protagonist with rather iconic armor and a backstory that was largely optional. Also crazy-awesome boss fights. It was Dead Space.
The series is going in a more action-oriented direction since the first game, it seems, but the original Dead Space is a vision of what 3D Metroid could have been and what I hope it can become in the future. Lose some gore and add some exploration, a set of boobs, and an allegedly intelligent space dragon and it's what I want Metroid to become.

They should do another 1st Person Metroid for the 3DS. I think that would be the way to go from here.