Fulcon's Review of Twilight Princess (there's good in there somewhere)

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

I'm trying to point out the flaws in his logic. Besides if he didn't want anyone to attack him/point out how he was wrong then he shouldn't have made this thread.

So you're basically saying "that's what we do at the ZU forums. If we don't like your opinion, we won't simply disagree with you, we will tell you you're not allowed to have your opinion and brainless flame you because we don't know the concept of having an opinion."

Where did I say that? If he posted this then he obviously must have wanted some form of debate. That is what I'm doing here.

Ocarina of Time is the highest rated game in the world...that's a fact and it's in the world record book even though it's based off of opinion. If people rate OoT 0.0/100.0 and they still do, that's their opinion, yes. But don't you think it's wrong to rate something really low just to emphasis your hate for others' opinions? That's what goes on everytime a Zelda releases, no ones making a big deal about it...but I'm sure every Wind Waker lover hates to hear people rip on TWW, and every AoL lover hates to hear people trash it. It's just not fun, in general to have your favorite game make poop of.

Twilight Princess also won grand awards for it's writing and for it's characters. Including Developer's choice awards. I can't say it was my favorite story, but it had some of the most likable faces I've seen in any form of media. And Midna is the most developed character in the entire series. KoRL, Tetra and Tatl put together.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

It is hypocrisy because all the "problems" found in TP are found in other Zelda games, and sometimes the issues are even greater in past Zeldas. =/

More prominent were they in TP.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

Twilight Princess also won grand awards for it's writing and for it's characters. Including Developer's choice awards. I can't say it was my favorite story, but i had some of the most likable faces I've seen in any form of media.

Yes, Fulcon. TP winning tonnes of awards completely invalidates your opinion. Seriously, why do you even try?

I mean, because critics these days are sooooooooo credible, aren't they?




Fulcon has an OPINION. I am sick of this happening to me and I'm sure Fulcon's sick of it too.

Tons. Tons. It was a reply to Talhoffer. An opinion has every right to be evaluated by...yet another opinion, and if you want to, you can continue to evaluate my opinion that's evaluating Fulcons. Poor poor you.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

Ocarina of Time is the highest rated game in the world...that's a fact and it's in the world record book even though it's based off of opinion. If people rate OoT 0.0 and they still do, that's their opinion yes. But don't you think it's wrong to rate something really low just to emphasis your hate for others' opinions? That's what goes on everytime a Zelda releases, no ones making a big deal about it...but I'm sure every Wind Waker lover hates to hear people rip on TWW, and every AoL lover hates to hear people trash it. It's just not fun, in general to have your favorite game make poop of.

Twilight Princess also won grand awards for it's writing and for it's characters. Including Developer's choice awards. I can't say it was my favorite story, but i had some of the most likable faces I've seen in any form of media.

Yeah, and getting upset because someone criticizes something you like is childish. And telling them they're not allowed to have that opinion is absurd. That's what so many posters here are doing.

Here are some examples of what I'm talking about. If I state an opinion of...

"Wind Waker was way too easy."

The arrogant, childish response would be...

"You must be the biggest idiot in the world for even thinking that. Wind Waker was challenging on so many levels, and for you to criticize it for being too easy is proposterous."

The mature response would be...

"Really? I actually found some parts of Wind Waker difficult for me. The fight with Puppet Ganon tore me up."

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

And Midna is the most developed character in the entire series. KoRL, Tetra and Tatl put together.

I take issue with this. Midna was probably the most underdeveloped character of all time. Quite honestly I've seen better developed inanimate objects. I've heard stories of furniture with more backstory than that stupid imp.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

Tons. Tons.

*checks home country icon, pissed off at lack of flag*

I'm from New Zealand. We do things differently from you 'merricans. I'm pretty sure this is how we spell the word.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

An opinion has every right to be evaluated by...yet another opinion, and if you want to, you can continue to evaluate my opinion that's evaluating Fulcons. Poor poor you.

Responded to, yes. Evaluated, yes.

Completely contradicted and shut down, no.

I don't think anyone is replying like that, but I tend to skip posts that aren't directed to me. People aren't really explaining why they're opinions drove them into a spiral of hate. They aren't saying TP was easy, they're just dissing it. =/ If it's okay to have an opinion, then is it somehow wrong to have another conflicting opinion?

I don't think so. I however, have seen this plenty of times, and it is annoying. I'd give TWW a 10 as a game, but in comparison to my other favorite's I'd give it a solid 2 out of 10. TP is an easy game, TWW was easy too...and so was OoT! I won't even bother defending difficulty because it kind of sucks in general. That said, I have died more in TP than I have in OoT, MM and TWW combined, I just don't expect everyone to play the game the way I did.

Oh man! Twilight Princess also sucks now because Midna has the personality of a dead moth! Wowww, okay.

No no no, you not follow. Midna had personality, but she was a flat character as opposed to a round/dynamic character. She stayed the same. She did not develop over time. Boring character to work with.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

I don't think anyone is replying like that, but I tend to skip posts that aren't directed to me. People aren't really explaining why they opinions drove them into a spiral of hate. They aren't saying TP was easy, they're just dissing it. =/ If it's okay to have an opinion, then is it somehow wrong to have another conflicting opinion?

Yes.

Now read your own words.

Again, you can't really say that showing dislike for a game is worse than making a thread to isolate the people who showed the aforementioned dislike.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

I don't think so. I however, have seen this plenty of times, and it is annoying. I'd give TWW a 10 as a game, but in comparison to my other favorite's I'd give it a solid 2 out of 10. TP is an easy game, TWW was easy too...and so was OoT! I won't even bother defending difficulty because it kind of sucks in general. That said, I have died more in TP than I have in OoT, MM and TWW combined, I just don't expect everyone to play the game the way I did.

Then it wouldn't be a good idea to contradict the opinions of other people.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

Oh man! Twilight Princess also sucks now because Midna has the personality of a dead moth! Wowww, okay.

Will you please stop misreading what people say?

"Midna's personality sucks" =/= "TP sucks because of Midna's crappy personality".




I can see how this is gonna go:

Zeldablue: "So you're saying that TP doesn't suck?"

Double A: "No, I didn't say that. I just said that Tal saying that Midna's personality sucks does not mean that he thought that TP was crap."

Zeldablue: "So then you love TP, don't you?"

Double A: "I didn't say that, I still somewhat dislike TP."

Zeldablue: "OMGZ YOU HATE TP WITH EVERY FIBRE OF YOUR BEING!!! UNCLEAN!!!"

Double A: "..."

Originally Posted by Talhoffer

I take issue with this. Midna was probably the most underdeveloped character of all time. Quite honestly I've seen better developed inanimate objects. I've heard stories of furniture with more backstory than that stupid imp.

Where I come from, we call those antiques.

I think you've isolated yourselves well on your own. You don't state a differing opinion, rant about it constantly and expect everyone to join in. The Zelda fanbase has been split since...the introduction of sequels. There will always be this tug, and it's obviously not just for TP. Assuming TP haters actually hate TP, they will never replay it again and will eventually forget why they hated it. It's been like this forever. However, people who do love the games, replay the games and continue to cherish them. For that reason, hate does die out over time, but love is a building process. Heck, I can't even find any OoT haters anymore, and I thought that would last forever.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

I think you've isolated yourselves well on your own. You don't state a differing opinion, rant about it constantly and expect everyone to join in. The Zelda fanbase has been split since...the introduction of sequels. There will always be this tug, and it's obviously not just for TP. Assuming TP haters actually hate TP, they will never replay it again and will eventually forget why they hated it. It's been like this forever. However, people who do love the games, replay the games and continue to cherish them. For that reason, hate does die out over time, but love is a building process. Heck, I can't even find any OoT haters anymore, and I thought that would last forever.

Originally Posted by Double A

Zeldablue: "So then you love TP, don't you?"

Double A: "I didn't say that, I still somewhat dislike TP."

Zeldablue: "OMGZ YOU HATE TP WITH EVERY FIBRE OF YOUR BEING!!! UNCLEAN!!!"

Double A: "..."

It's not hard to forget whe you're not playing something.

Lawlz. Yep. You forgot the part where you talked about not liking the hop function because it's too similar to the hookshot.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

Lawlz. Yep. You forgot the part where you talked about not liking the hop function because it's too similar to the hookshot.

Oh yeah!

Double A: "In terms of gameplay, the hookshot had a few similarities to the wolf jump. That annoyed me because it showed that the Zelda team are running out of ideas. It was also a quite stale gameplay mechanic by itself, making TP that much more of a chore. It was also unnecessary because of the presence of the DoubleA Clawshots."

Zeldablue: "OMGZ YOU HATE TP WITH EVERY FIBRE OF YOUR BEING!!! UNCLEAN!!!"

Tsk, tsk. Something so shallow as that. Link had a hat in Wind Waker, how unoriginal. :C This game sucks, it's just trying to be like something it's not.

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

Tsk, tsk. Something so shallow as that. Link had a hat in Wind Waker, how unoriginal. :C This game sucks, it's just trying to be like something it's not.

This just shows how whiney you are. What is your problem? I want to know what your problem is. Do you have a problem with people disliking TP?

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

Tsk, tsk. Something so shallow as that. Link had a hat in Wind Waker, how unoriginal. :C This game sucks, it's just trying to be like something it's not.

I'm not disagreeing with that. Therefore this attempt at making me regret what I said does not work.

Zeldablue: "OMGZ YOU DIDN'T DISAGREE YOU THINK LINK SHOULD GET RID OF HIS HAT U ARNT A ZELDA FAN!!! UNCLEAN!!!"

This just shows how whiney you are. What is your problem? I want to know what your problem is. Do you have a problem with people disliking TP?

No. I have a problem with people obsessing over not liking TP, to the point where it seems like all they really want to do is spend all day talking about their least favorite Zelda instead of playing their favorite games or even talking about games that made them feel happy. That's a tad annoying. But no, like I've said I can respect any opinion. It should be said maturely and with some sense. That's a start. I've had a debate where I nicely agreed with someone who didn't like TP, because they actually handled themselves without going overboard. If you want to overexaggerate and make people upset, you can do that. But it's just not sensible.

And as we all know this is but another short outburst of Zelda hate, eventually people who focus too much on TP rants will forget what they were talking about because they haven't actually played the game in 6 years, if ever. xD

Originally Posted by Zeldablue777

No. I have a problem with people obsessing over not liking TP, to the point where it seems like all they really want to do is spend all day talking about their least favorite Zelda instead of playing their favorite games or even talking about games that made them feel happy.

Better than making a thread specifically to isolate the people who disliked TP.