What do I want to return from previous Zelda games? Absolutely nothing.

And MM was the first to use transformation in Zelda (unless you count Pink Rabbit in aLttP. And if you do count that, you have problems).

Originally Posted by fratey

But to that degree? No.

You hit it on the head here. Yes MM did all these things better then OoT, but they clearly existed before. Just as TP did OoT's gameplay and story better, so did MM, but with different things.

Was merely a gimmick to limit certain items during certain moments. You can spend three hundred night cycles in Hyrule, and nothing changes. Sun goes up, sun goes down, moon goes up, moon goes down, rinse and repeat.

Not my point. It was there already, but just as with every other Zelda game, they took aspects of the previous game and made them better.

no, not at all.

oh? I seem to remember a number of villagers and cityfolk who go home during the night.

Now you compare transforming that MM had to the ****ty wolf form of TP.

Actually, I wasn't. In fact, there is an entire franchise called Transformers that predates MM.

And the Wolf transformation was just as well done as the MM ones, in fact, better. Combat? Nearly impossible with several masks. Movement? Poorer then Link other then the special movements of each mask.

Originally Posted by fratey

Personally I'd like if they stopped doing games around ****ty ideas and actually build up one. Right now it's just people shouting stupid ideas like "Train!!111", "Wolf!!111", "Boat!!11!11", "Hourglass!!11!11" and then building the game around that instead of building a story from the ground up like with OoT and MM.

I thought all Zelda games were built around the mechanic with a story to fit it.

Personally I find a story is better if it is set in a universe you made first, rather than making up a story on nothing and making a universe to fit it

Originally Posted by fratey

I want to use the Gale Boomerang, but TP sucks balls, so I don't want to play it.

You must be the only person who thinks that because TP recieved positives reviews all over the world. TP is one of a kind and I like it. The only thing bad about TP that I can say is the lack of challenge when it comes to the bosses.

Personally I would like magic to return as it almost always has something new.

At least have new items and find new uses for the old items.

For example, arrows could be shot at barrels to knock them and use physics to make them collapse and roll over enemies. The hookshot could be used in a way where it does not have to pull you in the moment it hits something, letting you create trip wires for fast enemies, swinging across ledges, ect. The bombs could have a charged throw where you spin around and throw it like a hammer (there could also be contact explosive bombs for example). The boomerang could have a sort of curve you could control so you could throw it around corners

That and there needs to be more dual usage of items. If you combine the boomerang with the bombs you could have a set of bombs you could throw at a bunch of selected targets. The fire rod and arrows could create more powerful versions of plain old fire arrows. If you use the hookshot to pull yourself up to the ceiling you could let go before you reach the top and equip the iron boots to drop down and let off a powerful shockwave.

Originally Posted by zaine09

You must be the only person who thinks that because TP recieved positives reviews all over the world. TP is one of a kind and I like it. The only thing bad about TP that I can say is the lack of challenge when it comes to the bosses.

You're going to be in for a rude awakening.

Originally Posted by zaine09

You must be the only person who thinks that because TP recieved positives reviews all over the world. TP is one of a kind and I like it. The only thing bad about TP that I can say is the lack of challenge when it comes to the bosses.

TP got alot of negative reviews aswell. Infact there are a tonne of people who don't like it.

I also find it funny you claim TP is one of a kind when it tried to be another OoT.

As for bad things about TP...

- The story is only good for the first half of the game, the second half its halfassed
- Exploration in the game seriously degenerates after the first half of the game to basically nothing
- The Twilight Realm was made to be amazing when it was only experienced in the first half of the game, you could not revisit it afterwards because it wasn't its own area but one under a spell and it didn't have much to do besides collecting all the orbs until the final area which had much more.
- Many areas were not that amazing or fun to hang around such as Death Mountain and the lifeless Castle Town
- The only new weapons were the spinner (a joke really), the ball and chain (an average item) and the Dominion rod (relatively useless outside of story elements). Also by the time you finally get a way to call Epona any time you want, its way too late.
- Zant was made out to be an epic villain until he was shoved aside for Ganondorf at, surprise surprise, the halfway point in the game
- Ganondorf was clearly thrown into the game and didn't really belong in there
- Zant was reduced from a mysterious and creepy badass of an enemy into a whiny, infantile and ridiculously lame jest who couldn't even get an original battle

The only good parts about the game was Midna, the first half of the game (story, exploration, overall feel, ect.) and some puzzles from various dungeons

Originally Posted by Aleitheo

TP got alot of negative reviews aswell. Infact there are a tonne of people who don't like it.

I also find it funny you claim TP is one of a kind when it tried to be another OoT.

As for bad things about TP...

- The story is only good for the first half of the game, the second half its halfassed
- Exploration in the game seriously degenerates after the first half of the game to basically nothing
- The Twilight Realm was made to be amazing when it was only experienced in the first half of the game, you could not revisit it afterwards because it wasn't its own area but one under a spell and it didn't have much to do besides collecting all the orbs until the final area which had much more.
- Many areas were not that amazing or fun to hang around such as Death Mountain and the lifeless Castle Town
- The only new weapons were the spinner (a joke really), the ball and chain (an average item) and the Dominion rod (relatively useless outside of story elements). Also by the time you finally get a way to call Epona any time you want, its way too late.
- Zant was made out to be an epic villain until he was shoved aside for Ganondorf at, surprise surprise, the halfway point in the game
- Ganondorf was clearly thrown into the game and didn't really belong in there
- Zant was reduced from a mysterious and creepy badass of an enemy into a whiny, infantile and ridiculously lame jest who couldn't even get an original battle

The only good parts about the game was Midna, the first half of the game (story, exploration, overall feel, ect.) and some puzzles from various dungeons

MM was too short!!! It just took elements from OOT and tried to build a game around them!!! They may not be new but TP introduced new uses for the hookshot, iron boots, and boomerang!!! What new items other than masks did MM introduce!!! Majora was a psycnopath too!!! How was Ganon thrown in!?! It perfectly chronicled what happened to him between OOT and TP!!!

Come up with better reasons!!!

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

MM was too short!!!

It was huge.

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

It just took elements from OOT and tried to build a game around them!!!

Just because it used the same engine?

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

They may not be new but TP introduced new uses for the hookshot, iron boots, and boomerang!!!

Again, they were merely gimmicks that were used rarely.

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

What new items other than masks did MM introduce!!!

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

masks

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

Majora was a psycnopath too!!!

So?

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

How was Ganon thrown in!?!

Last mine, he pops up, has no relation to Link.

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

It perfectly chronicled what happened to him between OOT and TP!!!

er, no.

Originally Posted by zaine09

You must be the only person who thinks that

Plenty of people do.

Originally Posted by zaine09

because TP recieved positives reviews all over the world.

So ****ing what?

Originally Posted by Darth Alec

Not my point. It was there already, but just as with every other Zelda game, they took aspects of the previous game and made them better.

Time was a gimmick in OoT and MM made it the key thing.

Originally Posted by Darth Alec

oh? I seem to remember a number of villagers and cityfolk who go home during the night.

Not really, we're just talking about two different Markets, one for day, and one for night. No one that really moves.

Originally Posted by Darth Alec

Actually, I wasn't. In fact, there is an entire franchise called Transformers that predates MM.

Yeah, because Transformers is a Zeldagame.

Originally Posted by Darth Alec

And the Wolf transformation was just as well done as the MM ones, in fact, better.

lol wat

Wolf Link is inferior to Link in every way. The only time you ever use him is for warping, and faster movement when you can't use Epona. He's the ultimate transport *****. Link can use items, is ridiculously superior in combat, and takes half of the damage Wolf Link would. Why would you ever willingly want to use Wolf Link outside of transport? At least some of Link's transformation were useful in combat, notably Zora Link.

Combat? Nearly impossible with several masks.

Zora Link was sexy in combat. Goron Link's spike stuff is great. Deku Link's spin is basically acrobatic transport goodness.

Movement? Poorer then Link other then the special movements of each mask.

Are you forced to stay in a form all the time? Not at all! Switch and adapt, not all masks are good for everything. For example, Goron Link or normal Link with Epona excels for transporting.

Originally Posted by fratey

It was huge.

Just because it used the same engine?

Again, they were merely gimmicks that were used rarely.



So?

Last mine, he pops up, has no relation to Link.

er, no.

Plenty of people do.

So ****ing what?

Time was a gimmick in OoT and MM made it the key thing.

Not really, we're just talking about two different Markets, one for day, and one for night. No one that really moves.

Yeah, because Transformers is a Zeldagame.

lol wat


Zora Link was sexy in combat. Goron Link's spike stuff is great. Deku Link's spin is basically acrobatic transport goodness.

Are you forced to stay in a form all the time? Not at all! Switch and adapt, not all masks are good for everything. For example, Goron Link or normal Link with Epona excels for transporting.

There were four dungeons

using the same engine is an excuse

well tp did have a lot of items and what do you mean the clawshots were used rarely

you're expecting link and ganon to be old pals

consider OOT had the word TIME in the ****ing title it was more than a gimmick

you peoople love the twilight realm but hate wolf link you have to take the good with the bad. even though i loved wolf link

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

MM was too short!!!

On;y if you count the story and that alone. For a game that focuses alot on characters, it would obviously have alot of sidequests.

It just took elements from OOT and tried to build a game around them!!!

Not really, it was based off 4 highly detailed areas where you had to help peoples plight in a world which was doomed within 3 days and you had the ability to time travel and experience multiple timelines whiles aso transforming into other beings.

They may not be new but TP introduced new uses for the hookshot, iron boots, and boomerang!!!

Though they weren't really that amazing overall

What new items other than masks did MM introduce!!!

Wow, way to completely ignore all the different masks and their possibilities just like that

Majora was a psycnopath too!!!

And you ignore everything else I said.
Majora leeched off the Skullkid to gain form. Which possessing him he was demented and was gleeful at the plight of others. With Zant he was a whiny infantile jester.
Quite a bit of difference between the two.

How was Ganon thrown in!?! It perfectly chronicled what happened to him between OOT and TP!!!

TP made up something happening to him for the sake of TP itself, not to explain any mysteries.
If Ganon wasn't in the game then he would have just been imprisoned and that is it. TP brought him back because it wanted to be another OoT yet he didn't even really belong.

Come up with better reasons!!!

And somehow by pointing out the flaws in some other game (which weren't even flaws) it means that all the ones I listed don't count? You didn't even address half of them, you were just trying to change the subject

Originally Posted by Aleitheo

TP got alot of negative reviews aswell. Infact there are a tonne of people who don't like it.

I also find it funny you claim TP is one of a kind when it tried to be another OoT.

As for bad things about TP...

- The story is only good for the first half of the game, the second half its halfassed
- Exploration in the game seriously degenerates after the first half of the game to basically nothing
- The Twilight Realm was made to be amazing when it was only experienced in the first half of the game, you could not revisit it afterwards because it wasn't its own area but one under a spell and it didn't have much to do besides collecting all the orbs until the final area which had much more.
- Many areas were not that amazing or fun to hang around such as Death Mountain and the lifeless Castle Town
- The only new weapons were the spinner (a joke really), the ball and chain (an average item) and the Dominion rod (relatively useless outside of story elements). Also by the time you finally get a way to call Epona any time you want, its way too late.
- Zant was made out to be an epic villain until he was shoved aside for Ganondorf at, surprise surprise, the halfway point in the game
- Ganondorf was clearly thrown into the game and didn't really belong in there
- Zant was reduced from a mysterious and creepy badass of an enemy into a whiny, infantile and ridiculously lame jest who couldn't even get an original battle

The only good parts about the game was Midna, the first half of the game (story, exploration, overall feel, ect.) and some puzzles from various dungeons

The game still did good despite all the negative reviews still. I am just saying that I havent came across any negative reviews besides fans whinning and complaining that TP is just like OOT just like you are doing. As a person who likes TP I give it a solid 10. TP was really cool and the story was kiock ass and I think they did an amazing job with the twilight realm. The game did seem a little too easy but that is about it buddy.

Originally Posted by Oni Dark Link

There were four dungeons

And getting to each dungeon took alot more effort than OoT, there was also piles of sidequests

using the same engine is an excuse

Not really, it was only 2 years after OoT, why write a comp;ete;y new engine when you can make the old one better like MM did?

well tp did have a lot of items and what do you mean the clawshots were used rarely

The dual clawshots were the ones most used and they weren't used much after its dungeon. The rest like the spinner and the dominion rod (especially the rod) were barely used

you're expecting link and ganon to be old pals

Relationship =/=always something positive like friends

consider OOT had the word TIME in the ****ing title it was more than a gimmick

Do you even know what the word gimmick means?

In OoT, the time mechanic was best used with the song of storms and the spirit temple and thats it

you peoople love the twilight realm but hate wolf link you have to take the good with the bad. even though i loved wolf link

Actually the Twilight Realm wasnt even experienced until you got to the Temple of the Twilight and even then it was only a temple and seemed very empty. The rest was merely the Light world but taken over by Twilight magic

Originally Posted by zaine09

The game still did good despite all the negative reviews still. I am just saying that I havent came across any negative reviews besides fans whinning and complaining that TP is just like OOT just like you are doing. As a person who likes TP I give it a solid 10. TP was really cool and the story was kiock ass and I think they did an amazing job with the twilight realm. The game did seem a little too easy but that is about it buddy.

I'm not whining or complaining, I am pointing out the obvious.

I too like TP but I know that no game really gets a solid 10 because all games have flaws and TP has plenty which you just ignored and made out like the only thing wrong with it is that it is too easy.

With the twilight realm they did a poor job and overhyped it. Like many I expected it to be an actual realm, not the normal Light World under a curse which you then dispell and cannot revisit.

As for the story, like I said it fell apart, among many things, halfway through the story. There was nothing really kickass about it. It basically felt as if it had alot of potential but halfway through the project someone said "Hey, lets try make it like OoT because lots of people like that" and thats when it started to fall apart.

For once I actually agree with Silver, but only to an extent. Zelda does need a lot of change, and I do recall Miyamoto saying that TP was the last of its kind. Really the only things I want to return in Zelda are, of course Link and Zelda, Vaati, the Four Sword, the Mirror Shield, something like TP's Hidden Skills, and horseback combat (which means Epona needs to come back too). Nothing else.

First off, I'm sick of Ganondorf and the Master Sword. Give them a break or never use them again. Seriously. Vaati and the Four Sword were much better anyway, if you ask me.

Next, stick with using orchestrated music. Not that TP's music was horrible, as I enjoyed the field theme, title theme, Midna's Lament, Midna's Theme, Hidden Village, and Queen Rutela's Theme, but orchestrated music has always been better than MIDI and probably always will.

I also want bigger overworlds, longer dungeons, and more dungeons. Basically a longer game. TWW had the right size overworld, it was just far too empty. The islands were all too small and you can't find anything but enemy platforms, subs, and other boring junk out at sea. The only cool thing was the Ghost Ship, and even that could have used improvement.

And lastly, we need a Mirror Shield again, as I mentioned at the start of this post. Why the hell did we not see one in TP? Isn't the damn shiny piece of metal MADE to go with the Master Sword or whatever legendary blade Link has? Its absence in TP is garbage. I don't care what anyone says. Imagine what could have been done with both the Mirror Shield and Shield Attack. It would have been awesome. I want a Mirror Shield like TMC's again, that could fire beams every time it absorbed an attack. Too bad in TMC you had to defeat Vaati before you could get it.

And that concludes my post.

Originally Posted by Aleitheo

I'm not whining or complaining, I am pointing out the obvious.

I too like TP but I know that no game really gets a solid 10 because all games have flaws and TP has plenty which you just ignored and made out like the only thing wrong with it is that it is too easy.

With the twilight realm they did a poor job and overhyped it. Like many I expected it to be an actual realm, not the normal Light World under a curse which you then dispell and cannot revisit.

As for the story, like I said it fell apart, among many things, halfway through the story. There was nothing really kickass about it. It basically felt as if it had alot of potential but halfway through the project someone said "Hey, lets try make it like OoT because lots of people like that" and thats when it started to fall apart.

I know it has flaws like every other game but it still gets a 10. What people need to realize is that not every other aelda game is like OOT. I know the same story is save the princess and stop ganondorf at the end but it doesnt mean it has to be like OOT. When they work on Zelda they dont stop and work on other projects they take they time and in the end it pays off. But like I said fans will never ever be happy with another zelda game because they will always compare it OOT.

Does anyone else find it sad how Zelda fans rate TP so low when it's one of the highest ranking games out there? Overall 9.4 average. Oh, man it's terrible. xD TP was an excellent game dispite what any fanboy dare say. The missing 0.6 points that TP failed to get are from the lack of VA/Non-MIDI music and from some missing originality.

And I have no doubt in my mind that the next Zelda will be a revolution to the series.

Originally Posted by zaine09

I know it has flaws like every other game but it still gets a 10. What people need to realize is that not every other aelda game is like OOT. I know the same story is save the princess and stop ganondorf at the end but it doesnt mean it has to be like OOT. When they work on Zelda they dont stop and work on other projects they take they time and in the end it pays off. But like I said fans will never ever be happy with another zelda game because they will always compare it OOT.

1- Who on earth is saying all the games are like OoT?

2- Way to make a generalisation there, not everyone who likes Zelda is responsible for the devs choosing to make TP another OoT. There are many of us that realise that OoT is just an average Zelda game and there are more original ones out there. TP is the result of the devs trying to make another OoT instead of a new and original game and it didn't pay off.

Originally Posted by Lady Ranny

For once I actually agree with Silver, but only to an extent. Zelda does need a lot of change, and I do recall Miyamoto saying that TP was the last of its kind. Really the only things I want to return in Zelda are, of course Link and Zelda, Vaati, the Four Sword, the Mirror Shield, something like TP's Hidden Skills, and horseback combat (which means Epona needs to come back too). Nothing else.

First off, I'm sick of Ganondorf and the Master Sword. Give them a break or never use them again. Seriously. Vaati and the Four Sword were much better anyway, if you ask me.

Next, stick with using orchestrated music. Not that TP's music was horrible, as I enjoyed the field theme, title theme, Midna's Lament, Midna's Theme, Hidden Village, and Queen Rutela's Theme, but orchestrated music has always been better than MIDI and probably always will.

I also want bigger overworlds, longer dungeons, and more dungeons. Basically a longer game. TWW had the right size overworld, it was just far too empty. The islands were all too small and you can't find anything but enemy platforms, subs, and other boring junk out at sea. The only cool thing was the Ghost Ship, and even that could have used improvement.

And lastly, we need a Mirror Shield again, as I mentioned at the start of this post. Why the hell did we not see one in TP? Isn't the damn shiny piece of metal MADE to go with the Master Sword or whatever legendary blade Link has? Its absence in TP is garbage. I don't care what anyone says. Imagine what could have been done with both the Mirror Shield and Shield Attack. It would have been awesome. I want a Mirror Shield like TMC's again, that could fire beams every time it absorbed an attack. Too bad in TMC you had to defeat Vaati before you could get it.

And that concludes my post.

Never use them again! Are you Nuts
You didn't like the music during the Dark Lord Ganondorf phase
Well to the above posters, TP had the biggest overworld of any Zelda game and waaaaaay more dungeons than MM
The Hylian shield is made to go with the master sword not the mirror shield
To the above posters, i'll refraise the question
name one new item that appeared for the first time in MM and has appeared since than XD:

Zeldablue i completely agree and hop you're right

Originally Posted by Aleitheo

1- Who on earth is saying all the games are like OoT?

2- Way to make a generalisation there, not everyone who likes Zelda is responsible for the devs choosing to make TP another OoT. There are many of us that realise that OoT is just an average Zelda game and there are more original ones out there. TP is the result of the devs trying to make another OoT instead of a new and original game and it didn't pay off.

It is not really like OOT and it did pay off because they are planning on making another zeld game right. TP is just what the fans wanted and cried about and the fans crapped all over it... that's just sad.

I agree that there is a lack of orginality because it was just suppose to be another gamecube but they decided to put it on the wii. I think that they are going to do a lot better to this one though. I am so hyped about the next zelda wii...