Stealth in Zelda.

[Ankiseth]

I don't know about you guys but I have always thought that Zelda was wasting it's potential when it comes to stealth missions. Every 3-D Zelda (and some 2-d) have had at least one stealth mission.


Most stealth levels in Zelda are simple don't get seen levels with no real satisfaction for getting through and no penalty for getting caught. I want that to change. Below is a list of things I believe would make the stealth in Zelda reach it's full potential.

- Add a new weapon specifically for stealth. Perhaps a knife. This could be used for stealth attacks from behind.

- Expand on Link's ability to hide. Give him more options than just hiding in barrells.

- Give Link the ability to distract guards by doing something like laying some ruppees down.

- Force Link to hide bodies lest he be discovered. (No he would not drag them like solid snake you sick pervs)

- Add ways for Link to get rid of guards instead of just stealth attacking. For example, lets say Link is hiding in a barrell. If a guard walks close by Link can grab the guard knock him out and toss him in the barrell. This could be used in conjunction with the ruppee thing I mentioned in order to take care of pesky guards who are otherwise difficult to stealth attack. Let's say a guard is always on patrol with his buddy. He spots a ruppee leaves his buddy and gets knocked out with his buddy none the wiser.

- Do more than just throwing Link outside or in a cell when he's caught. Make it so he is taken somewhere to be beaten and he has all his equipment stolen then thrown out. He would then have to go back and get his weapons along with do whatever he had to do in the first place (with tighter security might I add).

- Give us some sidequests involving stealth. Perhaps Link can be hired to sneak into a base of bandits and steal back some important item they stole.

- ABSOLUTLEY NO ESCORT MISSIONS! No one in their right mind would want to have to baby sit someone while at the same time making sure you and them don't get caught by the guards.

- Make it so in some levels you can't kill anyone. This would add some challenge.

- Make it so you have a choice between stealth and an all out killing spree in some missions. This would let people who preffer straight up fights to stealth still be happy. (some levels would be one or the other though)

- Bring back the hawkeye mask (or an item like it) so Link can still snipe enemies.

- Improve the A.I. Seriously, we want to kill smart stuff.

I'll probably think of more stuff later and anyone reading this thread is welcome to make suggestions of their own.

[Project 2501]

The stealth sections, frankly, suck. If they want to have stealth aspects, they shouldn't half-ass it; the number of options should be on par with a Metal Gear game, or they don't need to bother with it.

[Ankiseth]

Originally Posted by Project 2501

The stealth sections frankly suck. If they want to have stealth aspects, they shouldn't half-ass it; the number of options should be on par with a Metal Gear game, or they don't need to bother with it.

Exactly what I think. Their wasting some serious potential here.

[Adam_148]

-link hides in barrel
-link kills guard walking past
-link stuffs body in barrel
-shoves barrel into a room full of guards a few floors below so they think the killer is on that floor
-link takes potshots at guards from two floors up

[Ankiseth]

Originally Posted by Adam_148

-link hides in barrel
-link kills guard walking past
-link stuffs body in barrel
-shoves barrel into a room full of guards a few floors below so they think the killer is on that floor
-link takes potshots at guards from two floors up

I can totally picture that. The guards would be running around like idiots screaming " WHERE ARE YOU".

[MDS13]

- Make it so in some levels you can't kill anyone. This would add some challenge.

No, PH had enough of that all through the game until the point that you get the Phantom sword(creative name), and by then, you already know it so well, that it just defeats the purpose.

[Daphnes]

I to enjoy stealth in Zelda. The best one is in TP, before you get the the Arbiter's Grounds dungeon. It's optional, but if you go at night you can snipe the tower guards using the arrows and hawkeye. Just watch for the glowing eyes.

If you're spotted, fifteen or so Bulbins attack you, which gives a little motivation to do it stealthily.

As for hiding enemies, I suppose these sections would have people like the Gerudos in OoT and MM that don't disappear.

A special one hit KO attack like the mortal draw could be used, but only be effective from behind. And of course a sneak option. Hold down a button, and Link will sneak around without a sound. It's quieter than walking, but also slower.

[Ankiseth]

Originally Posted by MDS13

No, PH had enough of that all through the game until the point that you get the Phantom sword(creative name), and by then, you already know it so well, that it just defeats the purpose.

Well alot of people want challenge especially after how easy TP was. I guess it's personal prefference.

I to enjoy stealth in Zelda. The best one is in TP, before you get the the Arbiter's Grounds dungeon. It's optional, but if you go at night you can snipe the tower guards using the arrows and hawkeye. Just watch for the glowing eyes.

I also love that part. Definitley the best stealth mission in the series.

If you're spotted, fifteen or so Bulbins attack you, which gives a little motivation to do it stealthily.

Another reason I loved that part. It did something other than just toss you out. Let's face it fighting is a much more realistic choice Link would make. Why in the hell would he put his hands up and surrender when he could take those gerudo's like nothing? I can understand it in WW (he had no weapon) but for OoT and MM it was unnacceptable.

As for hiding enemies, I suppose these sections would have people like the Gerudos in OoT and MM that don't disappear.

Yes, and they would also get noticed by other guards instead of being ignored for no reason like the gerudo where.

A special one hit KO attack like the mortal draw could be used, but only be effective from behind. And of course a sneak option. Hold down a button, and Link will sneak around without a sound. It's quieter than walking, but also slower.

Yes, and also you could have a choice between killing and knocking the target out. If you kill them you don't have to worry about them getting woken up but if it's a bulbin or other monster it could explode (what the hell) and alert other enemies in the area. If you knock them out however it's more quiet but they may wake up after awhile.

[Project 2501]

I also love that part. Definitley the best stealth mission in the series.

Yeah, that was the one exception. What they did there that they didn't in the other games was basically to include Alert Mode.

As for weaponless Link, I'd say it's about time they gave him the ability to fight with martial arts.

[trinest]

Originally Posted by Adam_148

-link hides in barrel
-link kills guard walking past
-link stuffs body in barrel
-shoves barrel into a room full of guards a few floors below so they think the killer is on that floor
-link takes potshots at guards from two floors up

You can already do that, to a degree though...

[Adam_148]

Originally Posted by trinest

You can already do that, to a degree though...

what game?

[Ralphie]

Originally Posted by Ankiseth

I don't know about you guys but I have always thought that Zelda was wasting it's potential when it comes to stealth missions. Every 3-D Zelda (and some 2-d) have had at least one stealth mission.


Most stealth levels in Zelda are simple don't get seen levels with no real satisfaction for getting through and no penalty for getting caught. I want that to change. Below is a list of things I believe would make the stealth in Zelda reach it's full potential.

- Add a new weapon specifically for stealth. Perhaps a knife. This could be used for stealth attacks from behind.

- Expand on Link's ability to hide. Give him more options than just hiding in barrells.

- Give Link the ability to distract guards by doing something like laying some ruppees down.

- Force Link to hide bodies lest he be discovered. (No he would not drag them like solid snake you sick pervs)

- Add ways for Link to get rid of guards instead of just stealth attacking. For example, lets say Link is hiding in a barrell. If a guard walks close by Link can grab the guard knock him out and toss him in the barrell. This could be used in conjunction with the ruppee thing I mentioned in order to take care of pesky guards who are otherwise difficult to stealth attack. Let's say a guard is always on patrol with his buddy. He spots a ruppee leaves his buddy and gets knocked out with his buddy none the wiser.

- Do more than just throwing Link outside or in a cell when he's caught. Make it so he is taken somewhere to be beaten and he has all his equipment stolen then thrown out. He would then have to go back and get his weapons along with do whatever he had to do in the first place (with tighter security might I add).

- Give us some sidequests involving stealth. Perhaps Link can be hired to sneak into a base of bandits and steal back some important item they stole.

- ABSOLUTLEY NO ESCORT MISSIONS! No one in their right mind would want to have to baby sit someone while at the same time making sure you and them don't get caught by the guards.

- Make it so in some levels you can't kill anyone. This would add some challenge.

- Make it so you have a choice between stealth and an all out killing spree in some missions. This would let people who preffer straight up fights to stealth still be happy. (some levels would be one or the other though)

- Bring back the hawkeye mask (or an item like it) so Link can still snipe enemies.

- Improve the A.I. Seriously, we want to kill smart stuff.

I'll probably think of more stuff later and anyone reading this thread is welcome to make suggestions of their own.

NO thanks! This is Zelda, not assassins creed.

[rayburn]

I like the stealth to a certain extent but it could definatley use som improving.

[Darth_Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Ankiseth

Another reason I loved that part. It did something other than just toss you out. Let's face it fighting is a much more realistic choice Link would make. Why in the hell would he put his hands up and surrender when he could take those gerudo's like nothing? I can understand it in WW (he had no weapon) but for OoT and MM it was unnacceptable.

Well, he could have attacked the Gerudo in MM, but he couldn't in OoT. Having him going around and slaughtering innocent guards who are trying to do their jobs and protect the person you're sneaking int to see probably wouldn't have been a good first impression with Zelda.

[sugarpoultry]

Whey do people keep trying to make Zelda into other games. I hear a lot say "it should be more like this" or "the game should have stuff in it like this game does."

Why? Zelda is Zelda because its Zelda, not because its another game. It should be left alone.

NO thanks! This is Zelda, not assassins creed.

Amen. Why would I want two games that are exactly the same, just different characters?

[Daphnes]

Stealth sections doesn't make Zelda any less Zelda. It doesn't change the foundation of what Zelda is.

However, the growing linearism of the series is destroying the core of what Zelda is. That's another topic, though.

I don't think anyone is saying make a game that's all about stealth, but just make a few stealth sections that are more elaborate. For those that don't care for stealth, it can be optional. Just like at Arbiter's Grounds, where you can move quietly, or just run through and kill all who attack you.

Stealth sections won't keep Zelda from being Zelda, unless they make a Zelda game where you use stealth throughout and you need it most of the time to beat the game.

Then it would be more like Assassin's Creed, or Batman for GC.

[Ankiseth]

okay I think some people misunderstood my post.

I do not want a Zelda dedicated soley to stealth.

I personally find stealth to be a very enjoyable thing sometimes and I want the next Zelda to expand on it as much as possible but NOT however at the expense of the dungeon system we have all come to know and love. Zelda always will be an exploration game but that does not mean we should just keep it exactly the way it is with no innovation. I think stealth would be a very effective way to add a new layer of depth to Zelda.

Stealth sections doesn't make Zelda any less Zelda. It doesn't change the foundation of what Zelda is.

However, the growing linearism of the series is destroying the core of what Zelda is. That's another topic, though.

I don't think anyone is saying make a game that's all about stealth, but just make a few stealth sections that are more elaborate. For those that don't care for stealth, it can be optional. Just like at Arbiter's Grounds, where you can move quietly, or just run through and kill all who attack you.

Stealth sections won't keep Zelda from being Zelda, unless they make a Zelda game where you use stealth throughout and you need it most of the time to beat the game.

Then it would be more like Assassin's Creed, or Batman for GC.

My thoughts exactly.

[Lord Yoshi]

It depends. I hate sneaky sneaky like splinter cell or metal gear solid. If included it should be optional.

[Project 2501]

Well, you don't strictly have to sneak even in MGS; if I'm feeling particularly vindictive I'll strap on a carbine and simply gun everyone down in a ****storm of bloodlust. All that anyone's saying here is that if they continue the use of stealth sections in Zelda, they need to be improved drastically. The Temple of the Ocean King in particular was an abortion of good game design.

[Mr. Fish]

Have any of you ever played Beyond Good & Evil? Its a fairly unknown game quite similar to Zelda, but Zelda is better in all respects to BG&E; except the stealth. I did not enjoy stealth in Zelda, ESPECIALLY in The WindWaker. BG&E's stealth system wasn't much different from Zelda's, but somehow, it worked better. I dunno how, it just did. Maybe its because you weren't instantly killed if caught (although you would probably die), I can't really pin down why I liked it more, but if you haven't played BG&E, do so. It really is a good example of simple stealth gameplay done right.

[Ritogirl]

Stealth in the wind Waker was extremely poorly implemented it took my 3 years to get past the Forbidden Fortress becuase I hated that God Damn stealth mission. I beleive if they incorperate further stealth missions they should be optional, like avoiding a very strong monster that you don't want to fight.

[Grumble Guru]

Originally Posted by Ankiseth

- Make it so you have a choice between stealth and an all out killing spree in some missions. This would let people who preffer straight up fights to stealth still be happy. (some levels would be one or the other though)

The "all out killing spree" had better be hard, like, really hard, so it'll make me want to choose the stealth instead. The stealth stuff should definately be more advanced, and still more fun.