ZU Court.

Originally Posted by Sahara

When I get infractions from mods- each time I have been called names, and brought down.

If that is true, could you please show it. I would be greatly disappointed if a moderator took that sort of action to a member.

The thing is, Sahara, is that before some infractions, if the moderator feels iffy on what to do, they consult the rest of the mod team. It is not a one person says one thing so it goes that way. We have a great team of staffies, and they all have their own unique personalities and qualities. That insures that when infractions or warnings are given out, a fair trial is given on what should the punishment be. If there is a punishment to be given.

Originally Posted by Jason

...we don't need users to defend themselves. This is a forum. When a rule is broken, it's quite straightforward what the person did wrong.

Then why (in my case) is the other person treated better, and recieving hardly, if not any punishment at all- for doing the exact same thing?

Plus, we have staff - a team of 30+ people. Isn't that enough? Does everybody and their grandmother's pants have to have a say in something? Why do we even BOTHER hiring qualified moderators if you all just want to have a jury anyway?

I would just like to see some regular, average-joe member say-so in handing out punishments.

And another thing - court cases usually take years to process and finish. Why in heck would we want to bring that slow process to the boards? So that the accused can run around doing MORE damage instead of receiving proper punishment?

Yeah, for things like rape, and murder.

I highly doubt they would even take that long. And I also doubt that they would go arond causing more trouble, knowing that if they did, they'd be found out and proven guilty.

Plus, "defend themselves"? Defend themselves from what? A 4-point infraction - when they KNOW what they did? Are we going to test and see if a person is lying? We have databases that prove if somebody sent something that was icky, or said something worthy of an infraction. We have five years of standards - more than that, in fact - that sit behind us. What could a user possibly have done that is worthy of defending themselves? Unless it's trivial, there's nothing to "defend," because it's so straightforward.

You aren't getting what I'm sayinggg D:

I would try and defend myself from over-exaggeration. Someone is making it seem like what I am doing is a gajillion times worse than what it really is, and every time they talk to a mod about it, I get another nice little message in my inbox.

Posting a nasty image, for example, then making tons of spam posts. What is a person going to do? Go back and edit them during the court case and argue that he never made the posts in question? Horrible, horrible, and sloppy.

I'm sorry, but this idea makes NO sense at all...

That's what witnesses are for.
That's the whole point- seeing other views of people that WERE ACTUALLY THERE.

You aren't even trying to get it.

Originally Posted by Scott

While I strive to be fair in all dealings, there is a very simple point to remember. America has freedom of speech, and all that. But this is not America, this is the Internet.

Whereas in real life- I wouldn't have gotten in this much trouble for the things I said, so why am I in this much trouble here, over the internet?

Originally Posted by Comrade

If that is true, could you please show it. I would be greatly disappointed if a moderator took that sort of action to a member.

Those PM messages have been deleted. Though there was a case in the Community Thread, by a mod, after I had been infracted- and alot of people told me that I was getting my just rewards, when what I had done, wasn't that bad.

I'm sorry - none of those points make an ounce of sense.

We can't rely on witnesses - this is the internet, nobody is guaranteed to be around.

A discussion amongst the staff on a major issue takes about a month to reach a verdict. I can't see any reason why a court case would take less time. That's a ridiculous amount of time for a 4-point infraction. In that time, the infraction itself will have expired! You're trying to say that a person can basically get completely free of punishment by prolonging a court case long enough.

We don't need witnesses - we have a database. It logs what you do. Even if it doesn't, it does other things that we can check upon. Plus, if you edit a post, it'll tell us. It tells EVERYBODY, with an edit message at the bottom of the post. So, witnesses? Useless.

Forum pruning works best when the decision maker is 100% solo. All infractions and warnings are reported on in staff. If there are ANY disputes, the staff settles it - but these are rare, because most of the time the user deserved it, completely straightforward.

As for the "normal members" bit - you forget that we've all been normal members at some point. I still act like a newbie most of the time. We make sure that mods are still in touch with their normal member side, rest assured. Nobody is allowed to have an ego that makes the whole staff forum rise up into the air. But, to make a point, there is a reason why we selectively pick the smart, awesome people. It's because they know what they're doing - unlike a randomly selected jury.

I'm trying to get it, and I do get it. You just don't seem to understand that the internet is far, far more straightforward than real life. There is no need for this crazy complication. It makes no sense. You also don't seem to understand that if a moderator is not giving you leeway on a situation, that means that you DESERVED what you got - not that the moderator was wrong and you need a second, third, or fourth opinion to determine your punishment. When daddy says you can't have a toy, you don't go running to mommy and ask her instead in hopes you'll get a yes.

Seems to me like you're only interested in clearing YOURSELF of blame for your actions. That doesn't quite roll with me. Plus, the fact that you'd so willingly hand out the names of other members frightens me. I'll fill you in: Stating that you'll give ANYBODY'S name away without a second thought will not gain you very many allies in life... it makes it seem like you're everybody's enemy.

You're all too brainwashed.

Originally Posted by Jason

Seems to me like you're only interested in clearing YOURSELF of blame for your actions. That doesn't quite roll with me. Plus, the fact that you'd so willingly hand out the names of other members frightens me. I'll fill you in: Stating that you'll give ANYBODY'S name away without a second thought will not gain you very many allies in life... it makes it seem like you're everybody's enemy.

That's because I chose not to use other people's issues in this thread.

I'm not going to sink that low, thank you.

I said I was willing to give names in a Private Message, to a moderator.
How is that so bad?

...
Please lock this thread.
NOW.