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Navi's LISTEN!!! Thread
Beginning Note
If you are reading this because the title interested you, you have been surreptitiously deceived: I have made this thread to add onto the already numerous and varied opinions regarding character creation in the EH. Since you are continuing to read this, I assume that you are one of two things: extremely bored, or a person who has already made many characters and is wondering what another person could possibly say that hasn’t already been brought up two hundred times. The point in what you read below (assuming you are still reading this, that is) is not to tell you how you ought to be writing characters, or a “better” process of making them. If the following simply causes you to think about adding, changing, or considering your existing character(s), then I have accomplished my purpose in writing this. All of my advice has been divided into categories that follow (mostly) the order of the character creation template. I congratulate you thus far if you do in fact intend to read each section, whether you really make it to the end or not. If you read carefully, you may find that hints here can be applied to more than simple character writing. Appearance No, this is not the first thing that goes in a character profile. This is the first thing that I feel like commenting on. In your browsing of other’s and your own characters, you’ve probably come to understand that appearance is one of the most important details for you and other RPers to know. Without it, there is no outward appearance accurate enough for other characters to find any meaning or value in. Sensory Details: My comment here is not that I think most profiles are lacking in this area. While some are certainly far more detailed and valuable than others, they all serve the purpose of giving the reader a rough picture to form in their mind. My problem is that that’s all I see, a picture. Have we forgotten that there is more than one human sense? There are in fact five: sight, smell, sound, touch, and taste. I see characters painstakingly described in the visual sense— I can picture their hair, clothes, and shoes, but I can’t smell them. I can’t hear what their voice might sound like, what their skin might feel like. I don’t know how my character should react to yours because I don’t know if they smell like a ripe monkey or a pungent flower. I don’t know if their voice is generally gruff or strangely soft. Don’t underestimate the power of touching all of the senses. The more variety you have, the more detail and significance your character will have, and you will also provide other RPers with more deep, subtle details to cue reactions with. Even auras are significant: the kind of presence your character has due to magic or general abilities. We also have A LOT of aura sensers in the EH, and providing such detail (not just about how your character can hide their aura) will also allow other characters to perceive them at greater depths. Implicit and Explicit Details: Now, this isn't a particularly awful issue that I see in profiles, but it is an issue nonetheless. It's somewhat bothersome to read profiles that blatantly state what you as the reader ought to interpret from the character. Take a look at this: Quote:
What is HOT? Is hot being thin, or having voluptuous curves? Is a character beautiful if they are tall or short? Are blue eyes that sparkle prettier than green eyes that gently glow? What colors are the actual clothes that the character is wearing? What kind of clothing is it? What does all of this tell about the character in general? This is where the difference between implicit and explicit details begin. An implicit detail is one carefully placed within the character profile, which says nothing as to whether or not the subject is "attractive," but provides the story behind what actually makes them that way. If I give you a list of small, intimate details that are meaningful to the character, suddenly you have a lot more material to work with. Your character can decide for themself whether they like the sparkling blue eyes or soft, peachy skin. Maybe they're a green skinned alien that thinks human hair is absolutely hideous. Whatever the case, it is no buisness of mine to tell you how my character is. My job is to provide the details that will lead you and your own characters to their own conclusions. Explicit details are empty without their implicit counterparts. Coming up directly and simply stating what I think will make for a very vauge character. Little details like the fabric the clothing your character wears can be significant. For instance, it doesn't make sense for a peasant to be waring a silk dress around, does it? Nor does it make sense for a 12th century character to be wearing a white T-Shirt. Take the time to put things into context, to consider the world your character lives in. Tiny, implicit details like this will serve to tell the story of your character, as well as provide a firm base for other characters to build an understanding of them. I have provided a list to help with clothing items that will better match medieval context: Bodice- part of a woman's dress above the waist Breeches- trousers ending above the knee Coif- men's small, close fitting cap Fouriaux- woman's silk sheath to cover hair that has been coiled or put up. Girdle- a band of material around the waist and strengthens a skirt or trousers Jerkin- a tight sleeveless and collarless jacket Kirtle- knee-length tunic, or long dress worn by women Smock(frock)- An outer garment (generally a dress) traditionally worn by rural workers (also attributed to females) Tunic- any of a variety of loose fitting cloaks extending to the hips or knees (wordnetweb.princeton.edu) There are many, many more specific clothing items to that time period- this is just to give a general overview. While you can get away with using things as vauge as "shirt," "pants," and "dress," do remember that the more detailed and specific you are, the more depth your character will have. And you are also welcome to add more items to this list ^^ Meaning: The more meaning you can apply to a character through the use of detail, the more profound their interactions will be with other characters. If I come out and blatantly tell you each physical characteristic of my character, you'd be able to easily picture them-- then promptly forget. Attaching meaning, history to the attributes of a character will make them deeper and more memorable. Take a look at this example: Quote:
Height vs. Weight I'm sorry, but this needs to be talked about. Far too often, I see characters with unrealistic height vs weight. A five foot six person who weighs 100lbs is extraordinarily unhealthy and unrealistic. If you're struggling to find what realistic height vs weight vs build is, this will help. Weapons, Armor, Etc. Yes, I have something to say about this very simple section. I’ll be blunt. It’s exhausting to try to figure out what people mean when they throw technical words for clothing and weapons at me. I have to go google what on earth that thing is before I can even understand the details applied to this object of theirs. DO NOT assume that people understand what you are talking about. If you name a specific sword, gun, piece of clothing, etc. that is not general English; you are speaking the fine language of jargon. If you say your character wields an epee, you sure better tell me what the heck that is if you expect me to interpret your character’s weapon with any degree of accuracy. This can be accomplished in two ways: Defining: Take the time to include the definition of what you are talking about within the section that the word is included in. You can add it in parenthesis, footnotes, and even in the sentence itself. Consider the following: Quote:
I’ll bet you might have had some trouble. If you don’t know what on earth a discoidal cell is, or what the submargin of a wing is, all that information I just provided was useless. If you don’t know what a Radiant Swallowtail is, you might have even mistaken Leonna’s butterfly wings for that of a bird’s. How do you avoid this? Look at the following changes: Quote:
Pictures: I highly recommend using images wherever possible. They provide an even more vivid image than a description, and while it may not exactly match what you are trying to explain, the reader will be better able to actually “see” what you are talking about. This is a feature unique to writing on the internet, so exploit it as much as you can. Let’s go back to my previous example to show this. Quote:
Don’t expect other readers to do the deciphering for you. Few are those that are willing to fill in the details that you are not. If you want to be accurate, take the time to illustrate and define your complex terms. Skills/Abilites Allllllright! It's time tae' get down to even more nitty gritty detail! When looking over another character's skills and abilities, there are two main things that easily set apart those who can be specific and those who can't. Which do you think provides more accurate, easier to understand information? Let's take a look. Operationally Defined Abilities: Below are three specific variations of the same ability of a character named Xena. Note how they differ: Vauge Detail Quote:
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That's why operational definition is so important. The more specific the limits and powers of your characters are, the better you understand them, and the better others will understand them. If you can list exactly how an ability is executed and prepared, as well as its cost, you've just gained a broader understanding of that ability as well as when and how it ought to be used, and also how it affects your and other's characters. Significance: If you go beyond simply stating what a character can do and go into the history of that ability and why it works, you've just added significance to that ability. Suddenly, your character is able to do unique, interesting things that have significance to the rest of the world. This is best illustrated by yet another example: Quote:
Travel No, this isn’t even a section in the character guideline. I think it should be. Why? That’s why I’m here. The way your character moves about the world has everything to do with what kind of person they are. It makes no sense for a king to be walking about alone when he should be followed by his own royal entourage. If your character walks, don’t you dare try to tell me that they can traverse a distance of 24 leagues (72 miles) in one day. If your character has a horse, you’ll have to find a way for your character to maintain that animal’s health as they travel. These details are important because they impact the kind of attitude your character will have upon arriving… well, anywhere. If Jack has just hiked up a mountain in a week long trip, he’s going to be tired, dirty, and looking for shelter in a city loooong before he starts looking for fights. If Jill has rode her valiant steed into a city and wishes to travel on foot, she’s not likely to just leave it there in the street as she goes about her business. Can your character hunt in the wilderness? Do they have adequate supplies to be traveling in a desert? What experience do they have in traveling? Where have they previously been that might impact the distance they had to go between that point and the one in your current RP? Why do they bother to brave long distances at all? If you can’t provide any answers to these questions in your character’s profile, it may be time to add some things there. Character Bios: I've already made quite a few statements about this. ^^ The point I want to make, however, is this: a character biography is a biography, NOT a character fiction. If you are writing of only one singluar event, and are specific enough of that event to include dialouge, what you have created is a character fiction, not a biography. A biography holds the meat of a person, the most important facts and events in your character's life. If you write a 15 paragraph story about how your character slayed the mighty dragon Elohim, you're going to loose readers. Simple, short, to-the-point facts will declare to the reader quickly and simply the details you and the other RPers can understand about the character's life. This whole idea is best explained by LEA in the character guidline sticky. The problem is that this is grossly overlooked. Pay attention to the specific instructions here: Quote:
History Yet another section that does not exist in the guidelines. Personally, I think it should be MANDATORY for all NON HUMAN characters. Let me explain why. If I come up with a new race, I can give you an accurate picture of what this race may look like simply from the appearance section. What isn't included there, however, is the significance of this race. What is their place in the world? Would it be strange to see one in the midst of a crowd of humans? What role do they play in the history of the world? What is unique to this race and culture? If you don't answer those questions, you're missing out on a GIGANTIC opportunity to add depth to your character. If they're rare, my character would be surprised to see them. They'd likely have no idea what manner of creature they are or where they come from. A familiar race, on the other hand, would hardly earn a second glance, and my character would likely understand what their relationship to humans are. If you don't point these sort of things out, you're selling you and your fellow RPers short of what could be a great history and story. It doesn't matter if your character is as mundane as an elf-- everyone has different interpretations of them. What dimension you have added to elves is what is important for others to understand. This also applies to cultures and dieties. If I name a historical or significant figure you know nothing about, it means nothing to you. If I explian it, however, it suddenly gains meaning. You can apply this knowledge to your own character and the world they live in, which creates greater understanding and depth between two characters. Take a look at this example: Quote:
So, please keep in mind that when you introduce foreign characters (which is pretty much all of them) that other RPers deserve to understand their background. Without such understanding, it is impossible for them to fully interact with your character. Organization Organization is more important in character bios than you might think. The harder a profile is to read, the less people will read of it, and the harder it will be to understand. Don't be afraid to use text formatting options to make the best use of balance and space to make long reading easy on the eyes. Try this out: You have ten seconds to read the following excerpt from Leonna's character profile. Make sure to time yourself. I need you to read as much as you can and then answer following question: Quote:
Now try reading this, using the same ten second time limit: Quote:
By spacing and categorizing within each required feild, you not only make it simpler to interpret, but you also make it more comprehensible and memorable. By grouping information together, emphasizing the main points, and listing them systematically, you do what's called chunking. You're grouping relavant information together to create one simple chunk to remember. Is it any wonder that such formatting makes your profile look more intellegent and comprehensible? Taking Criticisim DO NOT revise everything you write in your character profile based on singular opinons. I can't tell you how extraordinarily important this is to remember. While we need to keep our minds open to constructive criticisim and our hearts ready for learning, don't take advice that isn't sound. If you don't understand it, question it. If it doesn't look good to change a phrase, don't change it. Be ruthless in the scrutiny of your own writing. After critisisim has been considered and you have pondered sufficiently over the matter, consulting other editors and readers for opinons as well, make the desision yourself. If you repeatedly recieve complaints over the same matter, you probably ought to consider changing it, but when both you and other readers are satisfied, stick to your gut opinon. There will always be those that disagree with how you write something, and in such cases, realize this: it is not humanly possible to please everyone. Better, yes, but perfect? No. Now, there is a thin line between being stubborn and being great. Being great means having a profile whose writing style and content has concrete support in its credibility, and confidence in its ability to convey meaning. A great writer will be attentive their feedback, do their homework, take the reader into consideration, and then decide where the commas and periods ought to go. A stubborn writer merely denies their weakness and lacks the creativity and work ethic to make something better. Their editions will lack confidence and strength because their writing is meant to fufill some vauge expectaction. Be aware of the audience you're writing for. Reailze that they are giving you their valuable time, and that they deserve to read coherent, interesting material. If they can't understand it, the issue is not theirs, it is yours. There is no profound idea that cannot be written well enough for others to understand. Taking this into consideration, also realize that re-writing isn't just a part of writing, it is writing. Without making those annoying edits, not only are you ignoring the very people whose attention you desire, you are also depriving yourself and your work of the opportunity to become better. So, when you are given a plate of criticisim, don't give in, and don't give out. Consider each of your sentences--you will always find something to improve whether you recieve feedback from others or not. Take time to weed out bad advice from the good, and test it. If it doesn't work, don't use it. If you can't understand it, work yourself until you can. There is not a singular writer who can claim themselves to be good naturally. Good writing takes real, active work, and that comes from actively trying to improve what you write. And good writing, of course, leads to good character profiles. In The End Well, Kudos for making it all the way here, my friend! ^^ As I said before, I'm not meaning to preach or say that one particular way of writing a character profile is better than another. I myself am guilty of doing the things I have advised against. When all is said and done, I hope that this thread has done for you what it has done for me: it maked you take a closer look at how you're writing and how this applies to your current works. Best of Luck, Fairess
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You can't fake bad writing! ![]() EH Characters: Leonna | Padme | Nerine | κρύος ίππος | Vinx |

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Re: Navi's LISTEN!!! Thread
This is a really quite well-written guide. I'm especially impressed at the sensory part of it; very few people ever consider the other senses with writing appearance for a profile. It almost makes me want to re-write Silly's profile, had I been less lazy. XD
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Re: Navi's LISTEN!!! Thread
I love the sections on biography and organization.
Biography was great because I absolutely dread reading some profiles because I'll go through some mediocre strengths, weaknesses, a sparse physical description, and a vague personality to find a Norwegian Saga awaiting me in the biography. Sometimes the when, where, why, how the character's parents hooked up was important. Most of the time it's not. It's also probably not significant that they lost their pet rock in the third grade or that they wet the bed until they were fifteen. Leaving out the insignificant garbage and hitting the important events is more than enough, and if that can't fill the ten thousand word quota you put forth for yourself, here's an idea: Screw the character, it will probably suck anyway. I've always found it tough to organize my characters well, and another thing that you might mention is that there are a lot of different ways to organize things. Adding color that's stark against the background and the rest of the writing, using indents to push sections apart, and using bold, underlined, and italicized text consistently works wonders. Colors that are too light don't work well against the background, the ones that are too dark blend to well with the black text. Indents can make it clear that spells or abilities are sub-dived under the major heading without using more bold and underlining than is necessary. Consistent use of the text accentuators (bold, underline, and italic) is using it the same way in every section. If the section heading is bold and underlined, so should the others be. If spells are sub-divided under the main section heading by just bold, that's the way it should be in other sections. It just makes it clearer and easier to process.
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Re: Navi's LISTEN!!! Thread
This thread was amazing to read. Thanks, Navi. I already changed/redid my Balthazar character because of this, and I'm going to redo Ceyrnan later.
Awesome thread, seriously. Thank you. <3
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Re: Navi's LISTEN!!! Thread
Well written and you bring up many good points to keep in mind when writing. I give you five gold stars out of five.
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Re: Navi's LISTEN!!! Thread
Ah, just an update. I added a new section. ^^
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You can't fake bad writing! ![]() EH Characters: Leonna | Padme | Nerine | κρύος ίππος | Vinx |

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