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Old 07-10-2007, 07:38 PM
8bit 8bit is a male United States 8bit is offline
Just keep saying to yourself, "I'm adequate."
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Four Demensional Objects

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lysis View Post
Dimensions are just ideas, really. "Time" isn't actually a dimension in the traditional geometrical sense, as the only three dimensions geometrically are "length" "height" and "width." Time is also just an idea, a measurement, rather than something physical. Time is measured by the Earth's movement around the Sun (or the movement of other celestial bodies, such as the Moon or stars), so Time is just a measurement of movement. Thus, it shouldn't be possible to "travel" time, as it's not a physical material, it's simply a measurement. Everything exists in Time, just as everything is in movement. Also, everything has three (or four, if Time counts) dimensions. Nothing can exist in one or two dimensions.

I'm pretty sure most of that is right.
Dimensions are just ideas, very much the same way that numbers, and math, and algebra are just ideas. There are an infinite number of dimensions in the world. For example, if an object has a price or a color, these are each two separate dimensions. An object's weight is another dimension, as well as its buoyancy. Each of these are, although synthetic ideas, still based upon a scientific observation. It's more the measuring system part of a dimension which defines it as synthetic, as there is no 'natural' way to measure.

For an example, Let's take a simple algebraic equation:

2+2=a

Now obviously we know that 'a' is the value '4', but what if we change the values defining the dimension, or variable, 'a'?

3+3=a

This changes the value of 'a' completely! Now 'a' is equal to '6'! Going back to my first example, even more interesting, what happens when I change the value of the number '2' to equal what we would think of as '2.5' in the decimal system?

2+2=a

Now remember, '2' actually equals what '2.5' would normally equal, so the value 'a' is actually equal to '5'! Yes, 2+2=5!

This change in the way we measure mathematical values is called a base change. Base changes can be very important to certain fields, for example computer science. Base10, the base we use (0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) can be inefficient and messy for handling boolean (yes or no) values. The simplest answer to this is to adjust the number system to have a 2 value base, one value for 'yes', and one value for 'no'. Lets do so right now.

we can use the numbers we already have and get rid of a few.

0 = No
1 = Yes

Now remember, these still represent mathimatical values. the more 1's in a number, the larger it is, and any number in this counting system can be converted back into Base10. For example:

base2-10 = base10-2

When applying this to the real world, if I see a small parking lot with 2 cars parked in the lot, I can say "There are 2 cars parked in that lot." if I am counting in base10, and "There are 10 cars parked in that lot" if I am counting in base2. This changes the entire way we measure mathematics.

If you didn't understand that all, it's fine, I'm tired right now, and I'm probably just rambling. If you want to understand this better look for a tutorial on mathimatical base shifting.



Assuming you're more interested in spacial dimensions, there are obviously the three spacial dimensions, however it's inconclusive whether the dimension 'time' has any properties that set it apart from the three obvious spacial dimensions, or if we just observe it differently then we observe hight, length, and width.

Going back to math, we can create a geometric object with an infinite number of spacial dimensions. For example, as we speak an object which exists in several hundred spacial dimensions is being mapped by mathematicians. Again, this object is an 'idea' and only exists, as far as we know, mathematically.


However, this all being said, every object has a physical quantity, weight, mass, buoyancy, length, width, hight, etc... so it's not so much that dimensions are only ideas, but the way we measure and conceptualize them are.

Quote:
Originally Posted by benhelmuth View Post
But the measurements of time that we have only exist because we have defined them. We had no idea time existed until we started measuring the movement of the sun and saying that was time. If you have ever stayed up between two days what defines one from the other? Midnight how can such an igsignificant event define our daily schedules? And to the allusion that i have been smoking something I have never ever smoked anything that was illegal and never plan to do so. As you can see my brain is already messed up in the first place.
This argument could be applied to any dimension. How do you know objects have weight? Sure, you can measure them, but how do you know what you're measuring exists? Hell, how do you know you exist?

The simple answer is that we don't. We don't actually have definitive proof of anything. However, the fact that we have a system for measuring these properties supports a consistency.

For example, if I flip a coin 500 times, and every time it lands on heads I would be inclined to believe that this coin is double headed. However, the possibility that this coin is a fair coin still exists, and if it is a fair coin I still have about a 50/50 chance of getting either side the next time I flip this coin.

Of course, at this point I would probably pick up the coin, check both of its sides, and realize I just wasted a lot of time flipping a coin 500 times.
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Last Edited by 8bit; 07-10-2007 at 08:02 PM. Reason: Reply With Quote
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